Glove karate (Shidokan)

[Discipulus]

And that is how you do not slip punches. Good fight!

 

[shinkyoku]

K3 (although they have since changed the term to G3) which is shinkarate rules for rookies (rookies as in new to the competition format in the organization, not necessarily new to fighting) and teens.


G2 (formerly known as k2). The "full rules" category.


Miniature shinkarate rules tutorial.


Glove karate exhibition bout -ending with a, for a exhibition bout, dick move.

 

[shinkyoku]

More shidokan glove action


World Budo karate league
yet one more japanese Glove karate organization

 

[shinkyoku]

Look at that ref doing karate kicks and shit while the guy lays there unconsious in the first video.

That is basic refereeing. He is signalling a Ippon (full point and win, aka knockout) score and showing what type of technique caused the score to be given (ie, a kick).
It is not some crazy showing off, it is what he is supposed to do.

 

[shinkyoku]

I already posted this, but since I forgot to mention that this is Masaaki Noiri winning the shinkarate u-18 championship title that got him invited into K-1..


anyway, since he became KRUSH champion september 1st.

 

[Mick Dojang]

Very interesting, thanks for the catalogue of great Shidokan videos.

One thing I notice with Shidokan is that it makes a lot of fuss about the triathlon format, but I don't think I've seen a video showing a bout that went the 3 rounds with the 3 rulesets. Is it common or are there tournaments more like KK or glove karate rules in practice?

 

[WDSTK]

Very interesting, thanks for the catalogue of great Shidokan videos.

One thing I notice with Shidokan is that it makes a lot of fuss about the triathlon format, but I don't think I've seen a video showing a bout that went the 3 rounds with the 3 rulesets. Is it common or are there tournaments more like KK or glove karate rules in practice?

My instructor fought twice for the Shidokan World Competition. At one competition, he had to fight 3 times on one night in 6 round format; 2 bareknckle, 2 MT and 2 MMA (don't think the MMA rounds included strikiing on the ground but I heard some tournaments allow that). I know of one fight that went the entire 6 rounds.

 

[Mick Dojang]

My instructor fought twice for the Shidokan World Competition. At one competition, he had to fight 3 times on one night in 6 round format; 2 bareknckle, 2 MT and 2 MMA (don't think the MMA rounds included strikiing on the ground but I heard some tournaments allow that). I know of one fight that went the entire 6 rounds.

Now that you mention it, I came across this, where the format seems to be 5 rounds (2 karate, 2 MT, 1 MMA) I think (haven't watched all of it)

edit: forgot video


Do you train Shidokan? I'd be interested to hear how it works for training. Like Shidokan seems to be its own flavour of karate in addition to the MT and MMA components. Are they trained alongside the karate or is it more like students train karate and are expected to pick up the MT skillset by crosstraining?

 

[Mick Dojang]

Also are the winners of the Shidokan World Opens listed anywhere? (if that's the main Shidokan tournament)

I'd be interested to see the top competitors at the moment

 

[SummerStriker]

Shidokan is probably my favorite combat sport to watch. They look the prettiest to me.

 

[WDSTK]

Now that you mention it, I came across this, where the format seems to be 5 rounds (2 karate, 2 MT, 1 MMA) I think (haven't watched all of it)

edit: forgot video


Do you train Shidokan? I'd be interested to hear how it works for training. Like Shidokan seems to be its own flavour of karate in addition to the MT and MMA components. Are they trained alongside the karate or is it more like students train karate and are expected to pick up the MT skillset by crosstraining?

Been training in and out of the same Shidokan gym for about 20 years. They have separate karate, Muay Thai and Judo Classes so mainly the karate, muay thai and grappling elements are taught separate but he does at times teach judo, boxing and muay thai in the karate class but it is too little to get good at it. Emphasis is on Karate tradition and bare knuckle in the karate classes. Our body mitt bagwork in Karate class is basic bare knuckle karate as well as any sparring. Our heavy bagwork in karate class is mostly boxing and MT although sometimes we hit it bare knuckle. He even has us hitting the speed bag and timing bag in the karate class. My instructor philosophy is boxers have the best hands. If you want to be overall good at Shidokan, you must take all the classes. If competing, you must take that class for that disipline. Due to my hip, I do karate classes but just boxing during the MT sparring. Judo I do easy just for testing purposes to show I know it. It is interesting to see our pro kickboxers and judo instructor taking traditional karate classes. I think it shows in their kicking when competing. Our judo instructor and several others have competed in MMA for a time. Don't see much MMA sparring going on but I think our pros and ametuers are just doing bare knuckle karate, judo and Kickboxing/Muay Thai tournaments. I know of an overseas tournament where one instructor competed in the Shidokan traditional bare knuckle karate>MT>grappling tournament. I think you only have a few of them each year if any and they are overseas. Several guys competed in San Shou a few years ago with one tournament in China. Anyway, I think it is a good gym and good aret with a quality product. I like this hybrid art that combines traditional TMA with more modern fighting arts. Great easy going instructor that produce a fun atmosphere for learning. My gym mates are great. Ah*les don't last long. Problem is there is just a handful of Shidokan schools in the states. As I get older, I do like the traditional karate and especially the Katas with my training. May even start competing in Katas in my old age as a motivatitor to get in shape.

 

[mikan]

Would love to see an adaptation of the Shidokan round progression for some of the boxing v mma match-ups. 2 rounds boxing/2 rounds kickboxing/2 rounds mma?

 

[Mick Dojang]

Would love to see an adaptation of the Shidokan round progression for some of the boxing v mma match-ups. 2 rounds boxing/2 rounds kickboxing/2 rounds mma?

ONE do this occasionally, they did a Mighty Mous vs Rodtang (I think) bout where it went MT -> MMA -> MT

It created an interesting dynamic where each fighter had the incentive to either survive until the next round or finish it in the current round, fun concept

 

[WDSTK]

Would love to see an adaptation of the Shidokan round progression for some of the boxing v mma match-ups. 2 rounds boxing/2 rounds kickboxing/2 rounds mma?

I would add a grappling round(s) in the mix, maybe just before the MMA. rounds As a fan, I would like to see the strikers first as I consider that better to watch then grappling. If the grappler gets past the striking rounds, good chance the fight would ended in the grappling round. MMA would still be last. Endless possibilities of incorporating different martial arts and rule sets that would make a fighter's strategy fun to watch.

 

[mikan]

I would add a grappling round(s) in the mix, maybe just before the MMA. rounds As a fan, I would like to see the strikers first as I consider that better to watch then grappling. If the grappler gets past the striking rounds, good chance the fight would ended in the grappling round. MMA would still be last. Endless possibilities of incorporating different martial arts and rule sets that would make a fighter's strategy fun to watch.

Would have been a great way to match up Floyd v MacG to make the boxer work hard early for the ko.

 

[Tayski]

Very interesting, thanks for the catalogue of great Shidokan videos.

One thing I notice with Shidokan is that it makes a lot of fuss about the triathlon format, but I don't think I've seen a video showing a bout that went the 3 rounds with the 3 rulesets. Is it common or are there tournaments more like KK or glove karate rules in practice?

I'd be interested to hear how it works for training. Like Shidokan seems to be its own flavour of karate in addition to the MT and MMA components. Are they trained alongside the karate or is it more like students train karate and are expected to pick up the MT skillset by crosstraining?

Shidokan isn't a huge organisation, it's an off-shoot of Kyokushin but I was always a fan of their approach of taking Kyokushin / Knockdown Karate and adding to it Muay Thai and grappling.

Yoshiji Soeno, the founder, is a legend, big respect to him. He grew up with Judo, then turned to Kyokushin Karate and was very close to Mas Oyama during the golden days of Kyokushin, and then learnt Muay Thai in Thailand to fight Thai fighters. He was a great fighter with the Samurai spirit and very respected by Mas Oyama and the Kyokushin peers. He was Nicknamed "the tiger of Kyokushin". He's one of the few to have split from Kyokushin and still be in good terms with Mas Oyama.

The tournaments aren't that frequent especially nowadays when MMA is so popular. The fighters who would normally be interested in something like Shidokan tend to simply go to MMA gyms nowadays.

In Japan at the Honbu of Shidokan, they trained Kyokushin (Knockdown Karate) twice a week and twice a week would be Muay Thai / Kickboxing, and then they'd have an extra day with grappling also. It was in the same dojo but 2 different floors in the building, 1 with tatami and the other with a ring and boxing equipment.

 

[Tayski]

 

[Tayski]

Here are the diaries of Jon Lovett when he went to train at the Shidokan Honbu (headquarters) in 2006:

"In April 2006 I travelled back to Japan to stay for two weeks at the Shidokan Honbu dojo in Tokorozawa. I was not grading on this visit so had arranged to do some sight-seeing in Kyoto and visit the Obakusan Manpukuji zen buddhist temple to learn about seated meditation, zazen. During the day I taught at the nearby Waseda University campus and in the evening I trained in the dojo. A meeting of Shidokan shihans took place in the Ito dojo whilst I was staying. The first part of the diary records my visit to Kyoto and Obakusan Manpukuji.

On Monday Tomoko-san took me over to the dojo about 5.30 p.m. after spending the day up at the University. Reku-san and the others were already well into training. The cherry tree is in full flower over the staircase. Mrs Soeno invited us in for tea and sweet brown yokan served on a small rectangular plate decorated with cherry blossoms.





We talk about Shidokan and the forthcoming shihan's meeting in Ito, which everyone is busy preparing for. I say that I'm planning to go to a zen buddhist monastry and Mrs Soeno jokes about how the monks hit students with sticks. The dojo has a comfortable smell of liniment and leather.

The evening is spent training with Reku-san. I need to get used to the stance again - left foot forward, pointing forward. Right foot back, almost in line with the front foot, knees bent. More like a boxer's stance than our usual square-on approach.

We work on combinations. Jab with the left hand, cross with the right, bringing the hips square, but not too far. Rhythm is important. Jab, Jab-cross. Jab-cross, Jab-cross. Reku holds up my right leg in Mwashi-geri so that I get into the correct position for delivering the technique. Body upright, hips into the kick, right hand along the line of the kick, left hand back covering the face, then the same with the left leg.

We start to work, Reku holding two Muay Thai pads. Jab, kick, moving about the ring. He moves the pad forward to meet the cross, bap, bap. My left leg doesn't feel as good as the right - but that's what the heavy bags are for, I can practice that later.

Reku introduces hizageri, he jabs me with the right pad in a hook as a signal to counter with the right knee. Hips in, body leaning back slightly to provide force, pushing Reku against the ropes. After a few rounds of combinations he says that's enough, we will build on that little by little, and I leave the ring to continue on the bags.

Reku spars with Taki, two kick boxing champions together. First they work with pads, then Reku puts on gloves and they spar. Both move with the easy confidence and smooth assurance of professional fighters, countering as fast as attacking.

After a couple of hours of training travel weariness overcomes me and I head for bed as I have to be up early in the morning ready to go to Inuyama.

On Tuesday we take a train from Tokorozawa into Tokyo to catch the shinkansen from Shinagawa to Nagoya. It was my first journey on a bullet train. The cabin is quiet with wide aisles and lots of leg room. The track follows the line of the ancient Tokaido, the route linking the Imperial capital of Kyoto with the eastern city of Tokyo. If kids in your dojo complain about the formality of bowing, then send them on the shinkansen. The ticket inspector bows as he leaves the cabin, as does the trolley lady.

We travel south of Mt Fuji and get a good view of the peak covered in snow. On arrival at Nagoya we change trains to pick up a local line to Inuyama, which translates as dog mountain, a small city home to Japan's oldest and only privately owned castle. On Wednesday we head onwards to Kyoto on the Shinkansen for some sight seeing.

It snows as we approach the city, and unlike Tokyo, the cherry is only in bud. First we visit Nijuojo, the Shogun's palace. It is impressively ornamental, the rooms are decorated with screens depicting tigers and leopards on a background of gold. A wide wooden corridor surrounds the central rooms and it squeaks as we walk. This is a cleverly engineered nightingale floor, designed to prevent anyone from sneaking up on the shogun. Even if he was attacked, there were ninja warriors waiting in special rooms next to the meeting chambers.

The upper palace is enclosed by a moat and raised on walls made of massive stones. After Nijuojo we visit Kinkaku-Ji, the golden temple, another display of opulence. As a contrast to the wealth and power inherent in the Shogun's palace we walk to Ryoan-ji, a simple zen stone garden. This too attracts crowds of visitors.

Although it is set in extensive grounds, the famous ancient arrangement of fifteen stones in raked gravel at Ryoan-ji is not large. On two sides it is flanked by a modest temple building, the other sides are a wall. Many people are sitting along one side of the temple on banked steps looking at the stones or taking photographs. The guide book tells us about the riddle of the stones and their hidden zen meaning. I think about the Unfettered Mind and imagine a zen master instructing a novice to meditate on the nature of stones, and then to meditate on the nature of arrangement of stones. Staring at the stones they become islands in a sea of gravel. One thing I must remember in future is not to wear lace up boots, they take ages to get on an off when entering temples.

From Ryoan-ji we catch a bus to Gion, the district famous for housing the floating world of geishas. Browsing the shops we see a geisha leaving in a taxi, presumably for an assignation in the many hotels in the narrow streets of old Kyoto. We go in search of old prints and find a shop full of them, prints of Noh play characters, landscapes and stations of the Tokaido - but way beyond my price range.

We walk down the busy shopping streets with huge department stores and fashion houses. Although it is cold the streets are jammed with shoppers. In the evening we go out for a traditional Kyoto meal. This consists of many different courses of tofu, each with distinct delicate flavours.

In the morning I make a presentation in Kyoto University and they treat us to a traditional Japanese lunch of raw tuna chunks, which are quite slippery and difficult to pick up with chop sticks.

After lunch we catch a train to Obakusan Manpukuji for a course on zen meditation. The extensive temple complex is set back onto hillside. The timber buildings are built with massive beams on a grand scale and are draped with purple banners. Everything is well ordered and efficient.

We go to the office and meet the monk who is to teach us zazen, seated meditation. He is young, friendly, handsome, lithe and with warm clear eyes. He takes us to the meditation hall, which is deep in the temple complex, and gives us a sheet of instructions to read while he opens the great wooden doors that lead into the hall. Inside the hall are rows of benches just under waist height and on the benches are rows of square white cushions, two cushions on top of each other. The floor is diamond squares of dark grey tiles, there is no heating and the hall is pretty cold. The monk folds the top cushion in half so that there are a total of three layers of cushion. This is for sitting on and the only comfort we are going to get.

He shows us how to get into the zazen position, left foot first, then right into a lotus. Then right hand under left forming an O with the palms and thumbs. The back, neck and head are straight, eyes looking down and forward to focus on the floor about a metre away. I can only manage half a lotus, but he says that is fine, just tuck one leg underneath with one on top. He tells us to breathe through the nose using the stomach and to count from one to ten in our heads. Then he gets a large wooden rod and explains that if we cannot hold the position we will be hit on the back, six times. We are to meditate for fifteen to twenty minutes.

I focus my eyes on a junction of the square tiles, the monk beats a drum and the zazen starts. He comes round to check my position, my back is not straight enough so he puts the rod up against it as a ruler to ensure my posture is upright. The first fifteen minutes pass quite well. I count from one to ten and concentrate on breathing, but find my mind wandering to mundane things and have to make an effort to bring it back to the count.The monk rings a bell and says that we can stretch our legs in a short break. Break? I thought that was it. But no, that was the first little stretch of zazen. Now we are going to do another fifteen minutes. He beats the drum. It starts to get hard. The muscles in my legs and back are beginning to ache. I try to relax and concentrate. The bell can't come soon enough. I say I am having difficulty concentrating and he says we have to look within ourselves. Another short break, and then another fifteen minutes. The muscles in my back are beginning to shiver and I think I'm going to fall off the bench backwards. The monk sees this and comes to stand in front of me with the rod. We bow, hands together, then I lean forward, hands on the bench, head down. He whacks the rod on the muscles running down the spine, three times on each side. I have never been so grateful for being hit with a stick. The blows jolt the muscles back to normal. We bow again and I finish the meditation.

The monks meditate for four hours a day, one hour in the morning and three hours in the evening, winter and summer. We leave the hall and go into a tatami room with low tables and kneel to recite a sutra. On the tables is the calligraphy of the sutra covered by transparent thin rice paper. Using a calligraphy brush we trace the characters of the sutra, write the date and record a wish. Mine is happiness for my children. The monks will read the sutra for us in the morning. We head back to Kyoto, hop on the shinkasen and hurtle back to Tokyo. I'm back in the dojo by 10 pm."

 

[Tayski]

Second part:

"This is the second part of my April 2006 dojo diary. I continue training with Reku-san and meet Shidokan shihans from all over the world as they come to a meeting in Ito dojo. Together with students from Waseda University we compose a haiku to present to the Tokorozawa dojo.

Friday. Kancho Soeno called by the dojo in the morning. I was the only one in, reading in my room before heading up to the University, so it was quite a surprise to see Kancho's head pop round the door. He gave a big smile and said hello. He was enjoying the cherry blossom. Afterwards I heard him clap to the shrine in the dojo.

In the evening I trained with Reku-san. We worked on keeping my body upright around the centre line - I need to move around this line to keep the attacks sharp and focused. Reku introduced the combination of jab-cross, cross, cross-hook, cross. The rhythm is Bab-bab, Bab, Bab-bab, Bab. I had to be careful to return sharply to a good stance to keep shape and balance. For the left leg kick the first step forward is with the right, kick, left leg down to right, then right leg back. The movement is one-two-three rather than a switch.

It is cold outside, but the dojo is heated by a space heater between the boxing ring and racks for pads and gloves. A tiny old woman, bent with age, wrapped in a shawl, came in and sat by the fire. Everyone just kept on training, nobody broke rhythm.

After about half an hour she said thank you and left. I stopped training at 9.30 p.m. and went to bed at 10.00. About 10.30 three visitors arrived for the Ito shihan meeting, one from Belgium the other two from Spain. They went out with Shihan Tatsuichi and came back around 2.00 a.m.

Saturday. It's very chilly in the morning and the visitors complain about the cold. I guess I'm used to it by now. When I got back to the dojo in the late afternoon Tatsuichi's wife Yuko was there with a tiny baby, only four days old. So sweet! The whole family came out to take pictures of the baby under the cherry tree.

I chat with the shihan from Belgium and we go down to the dojo and train on the bags. When Reku-san arrives we work together on hizageri. It's getting a lot better. Reku looked a bit surprised when I finally got the hang of it. I'm still messing up the combinations. I can get them OK on the bags, but tend to rush them when confronted by focus mitts and so lose the sequence. I need to think about rhythm more, relax, not to rush, and finish each technique. The dojo is pretty busy. The visitors went out for dinner around 10.00 p.m., got back late and then are up before 6.00 a.m. for the journey to Ito.



Sunday. All is quiet now, I think I'm the only one left here. Everyone is at Ito dojo. I spent the day at the University and then turned in early for bed. There is a lot of rain in the evening and night.

The black spiral staircase of the dojo is speckled with white cherry petals. Monday. After the rain it is a beautiful clear sunny morning.

On the train out to Kotesashi I can see the hills surrounding Tokorozawa, and on the left-hand side Mt Fuji covered in snow. It must be nearly 100 km away, but looks much closer.

When I get to the University I climb to the top of the building with Prof Amano to try and get a photograph, but there is a strong wind blowing and it is difficult to hold still. Prof Amano tells me that this spring wind is called Hana Arashi - flower storm. The wind blows steadily throughout the day.

By the afternoon dust obscures the horizon and the hills are again hidden from view. It is odd to think that Mt Fuji is there all the time but I have only seen it once. Evening training is much better today, my muscles are getting used to it and I'm a few kilos down from office weight.

The shihans are back from Ito. Reku says they were up until 3.00 a.m. They bring instructions from JJ that I have to work on Shikon no Kata while I am here so that I can bring it back to the UK. The shihans seem to have had a pretty good meeting, and there is a lot of intense discussion. I went into the supermarket to get some fruit juice and bought a packet of what I thought were special Japanese nuts, which I didn't recognise and of course could not read what it said on the packet. When I tried them, I found they aren't nuts, they are beans and not a bit crunchy. Still, they taste quite nice and I'll eat them for breakfast.

Shinyobu called to chat to the shihans from Costa Rica, she is having dinner with JJ and Yuka-san, so I have a chat with JJ. The Ito meeting sounds fun. JJ said the training with Kancho was quite hard, all kihon, with the dojo very hot humid and crowded with about 6o people, mostly blackbelts, after a while the floor was covered in sweat and slippery. But very enjoyable especially with so many blackbelts kiaing at the same time and encouraging each other when the going got tough and Kancho coming round hitting people with a shinai if stances were wrong. Kancho told everyone to do press ups on the knuckles, but he didn't say when to stop. So people did, say 50, then stopped, then had to carry on and do some more.

Tuesday. I worked on Shikon no kata yesterday afternoon with the young brown belt who knows a lot of kata and think I have it sorted now. The energy gathering bit is definitely in back stance not front stance; the second kick is a side snap kick to the right and not a back kick; and the mwashi uke series at the end are two circles forward in sanchin dachi, one in the reverse direction backwards into back stance.

After kata practice I trained on the bags and then with Reku before the karate class at 6.30. Although I still muddle some combinations, particularly those with upper cuts, sparring with Reku is really coming on and much smoother than before. We went through three rounds of constant combinations with nice flow, which felt pretty good.

Shihan Tatsuichi took the karate session and was joined by some of the visiting shihans. Afterwards he went through Saifa kata which is based around defence and attack in the dark. To prove the point he switched off the lights and demonstrated the bunkai with the young brown belt student.

After training Shihan Tatsuichi invited the visiting shihans and myself to dinner at the sushi restaurant just down the road from the dojo. The restaurant is managed by a former student of the dojo so we were given a private room and wonderful food. Two of the visiting shihans are from the island of St Martin in the Caribbean and showed us their plans for a Caribbean Shidokan dojo. The table was low, Japanese style, when I got up the muscles on the inside of my thigh went into cramp. I hadn't stretched off after training. Getting my shoes on was tricky.

Wednesday. Fresh green leaves are unfolding on the cherry tree by the dojo, signalling the end of the flowering period. Petals are beginning to fall in drifts.

We held the last student seminar today at the University, so in the evening we went out to an Okinawanan restaurant in Tokorozawa with all the students and Prof Amano. We all sat round a low table on a wooden bench and started out with a glass of beer, special seaweed and other delicious Okinawanan food. We aim to write a haiku to present to the dojo. I start out with a Japanglish hybrid "Hana arashi, Petals fall on the staircase, View of Mt Fuji".

The idea behind the haiku is that there may be disagreements, represented by the spring flower storms and falling petals, but Fuji-san is there all the time, and can be seen rising up after rain has cleared the air. One of the students comes up with a translation for the last line "Fuji no yama". So we're doing pretty well, just the middle line to do. But then there is a lot of discussion. The problem is that we have cherry blossom twice, once in "Hana arashi", and again with the petals on the staircase. This won't do at all. In the meantime I've finished my beer and a huge glass of special Okinawanan Awamori sake appears in front of me, together with a top up for the beer. The sake is pretty strong.

Another haiku line is suggested "Kaze no mukouni" - meaning the wind from behind, or over there, to represent the distance to Fuji san. The students think I should try some 8 year old sake, Zuisen, so another glass is lined up to join the beer and Awamori.

One of the students proposes the line "Fuji no mine" - which represents the curve of Mt Fuji. Of course, the 8 year old Zuizen now needs to be contrasted with Shochu from central Japan, and another glass appears. I now have four glasses to choose from.

We start discussing the poems of the haiku master Matsuo Basho. One of the students is from Basho's home town, Ueno, and reveals that that the town is also famous for its ninja school. Naturally enough, what with all that beer and sake, we have a lively discussion about whether or not Basho was a ninja which ends with the students practising finger-tip press ups on the bench.

Meanwhile, one of the students who is a haiku specialist has been working away. This is his haiku: "Yukifuji no, Kubimoto kazaru, Hana arashi". Which means something along the lines of the cherry blossom petals blown by the spring flower storm make a snow collar for distant Mt Fuji. We all agree this is pretty damn good and another student whose hobby is calligraphy writes the haiku in beautifully drawn characters and slots the finished poem into a decorated mount ready to be presented to the dojo.

Thursday. I present the haiku to Shihan Tatsuichi after Karate training.

Sunday. I'm up early and on the 6.30 am bus from Tokorozawa to Narita, returning back to England."