Law Founding fathers rolling over in their graves

ObsoleteSoul said:
As said many times, this is about the separation of church and state. The alphabet crew are not a religious group, so it is not an apt comparison. I also get not wanting to teach that in the classroom, but we need to choose the right arena and methods to fight against that. Blurring the line of separation is not a good way to achieve it imo
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Why can't we just have kids learning math and language arts?

And I'd argue that by definition, LGBTetc. is a religion. Its just not one based in "gawd".
 
Seano said:
"Religion" isn't just a belief in a divine being.
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Ok, so please explain how it is a religion then.

If you are using the supreme importance aspect of the definition, then it could be said going against the alphabet crew is your religion. I’ll stick to the time tested definition instead of the one where it could easily be applied to basically anything.
 
Seano said:
And I'd argue that by definition, LGBTetc. is a religion. Its just not one based in "gawd".
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Yeah, it's Christianity.

Love thy neighbor, turn the other cheek, let he who is without sin, it definitely feels like Christianity was built for LGBTQ.

The overt hatred for LGBTQ doesn't feel very Christian.
 
ObsoleteSoul said:
Ok, so please explain how it is a religion then.

If you are using the supreme importance aspect of the definition, then it could be said going against the alphabet crew is your religion. I’ll stick to the time tested definition instead of the one where it could easily be applied to basically anything.
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Here is one definition of religion-
a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance.

If you make LGBTetc your entire being, then its your religion. If you want to teach it to kids, how is that different than "preaching the gospel"? If it defines who you are, how you live your life, your entire moral code- its your religion.

You're stuck on the idea of a deity, is all.
 
Seano said:
Here is one definition of religion-
a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance.

If you make LGBTetc your entire being, then its your religion. If you want to teach it to kids, how is that different than "preaching the gospel"? If it defines who you are, how you live your life, your entire moral code- its your religion.

You're stuck on the idea of a deity, is all.
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So yours would be the fight against it, because you do it on a daily basis. It’s an add-on to the definition, much like they try to do it with racism, and how it only applies to those in power.
 
jk7707 said:
This line of argument that you've dedicated yourself to go down is so insanely stupid that I have to assume you're trolling here.
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Thanks for yet another empty emotional post in place of any argument. Par for the course from you.

DoctorTaco said:
Holy shit that bad hermeneutics. According to the Bible you’d be going to hell. They don’t believe god is inside you unless you repent and invite him in, and they don’t believe you really did so unless you

It’s in the Christian Bible which is a splinter religion from Judaism. Just because god and allah have the same meaning doesn’t make them the same root word in the same language you goof.

No they don’t. The first 4 are literally about worshipping the Christian god.

this is unconstitutional. Period. Shouldn’t the constitution be honored and reflected in our laws and society?
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Obviously you've yet to explain how this harms school children even potentially, because that's obviously a dead end that would require some real mental gymnastics.


Your arguments looking for a technicality to wrestle control of a state you don't even live in have a lot of hurdles in your way as well. The thread title about the "founding fathers" is based on a mistake on your part.

States did have established churches when the 1st amendment was ratified that were not bothered, and the amendment was specifically for the federal government and congress passing laws. This was also talking about actual churches, like the church of England or the Congregational church, Catholic church etc, not blanket Christianity and Judaism.


Any application on the state level would have to come from court precedent over a century later. Louisiana doesn't follow English common law, their legal system is based on legislation rather than court precedent, which does not obligate them to follow a century later interpretation by a judge.

The next attempt to wrestle control from a state you don't live in would be the supreme court, and that might well be a dead end as well since they've already ruled that the passive display of the 10 commandments in front of the Texas capitol is constitutional.
 
Gotosleepho said:
Do you believe that women who commit adultery should be stoned
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Yes. Committing adultery stone cold sober is madness.
DoctorTaco said:
To the “America is built on judeo Christian values” group:

All who believed were together and had all things in common; they would sell their possessions and goods and distribute the proceeds to all, as any had need. ... Now the whole group of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one claimed private ownership of any possessions, but everything they owned was held in common. ... There was not a needy person among them, for as many as owned lands or houses sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold. They laid it at the apostles' feet, and it was distributed to each as any had need."[48]

— Acts 2:44–45, Acts 4:32–35

Matthew 6:24,[49] which said: "No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money."

Acts 4:35, which says "to the emissaries to distribute to each according to his need".[51][52]

If you have two coats, give one away," he said. "Do the same with your food." -luke 3:11
James 5:1-3 “Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming upon you. Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. Your gold and silver are corroded. Their corrosion will testify against you and eat your flesh like fire. You have hoarded wealth in the last ways
The Bible mentions debt forgiveness in several places, including:
  • Luke 7:36-50, 11:2-4, 16:1-13: Jesus links forgiveness of money debts and spiritual debts
  • Matthew 6:9-15, 18:21-35: Jesus says that the forgiveness of debts is contingent on the forgiveness of others' debts
  • Deuteronomy 15:1-2: This passage provides for legislative release of debt at the end of every seven years
Deuteronomy 23:19-20 – “You shall not charge interest on loans to your brother, interest on money, interest on food, interest on anything that is lent for interest.


sounds like the capitalist society we have here in America /s
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ColemanwastheGOAT said:
It's an objective fact.
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America is whole cloth capitalism. The teachings of Christ aren’t.
 
ObsoleteSoul said:
So yours would be the fight against it, because you do it on a daily basis. It’s an add-on to the definition, much like they try to do it with racism, and how it only applies to those in power.
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Honestly, my feelings about it are about the same as yours on teaching Jesus in school. (Or what I assume your feeling would be)
People being gay means nothing to me. It doesn't bother me. I don't judge a person on it. I view LGB activists like amore annoying version of Jehova's witnesses. Trans activists I think are harmful, however. I will make that clarification.

I will admit that lately, I've seen such a decline in morality and decency that I'm not sure I have a problem with the commandments in school. Society having no moral code has not really been a benefit to us, IMO. I wouldn't have thought that 15 years ago.
 
nostradumbass said:
Obviously you've yet to explain how this harms school children even potentially, because that's obviously a dead end that would require some real mental gymnastics.
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So what you’re saying is as long as you aren't harming anyone, do as you wish?
 
Of all the things that made the founding fathers start spinning around in their graves I think transgender children, dudes marrying dudes, and members of congress espousing socialism is a bit more bothersome than schools posting the commandments in their classrooms.
 
DoctorTaco said:
So what you’re saying is as long as you aren't harming anyone, do as you wish?
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No, I don't think I would use a blanket "do as you wish", I pointed out that it isn't an argument you've tried to make here. "Harming anyone" including yourself would be the first and most obvious reason to oppose something, public interest or changing the purpose of an existing institution or tradition would be a secondary reason, and financial cost would be another, prioritizing the interests of the minority over the majority would be another. I'm sure there are others, but those are some of the main reasons to oppose legislation.
 
king hippo said:
it's a reaction to this. are you surprised? both don't belong there, but one's a million times worse...

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I mean you don’t have to choose one or the other. Both things are bad and you can be against both things in the classroom
 
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