Sherdog Mixed Martial Arts Forums

Go Back   Sherdog Mixed Martial Arts Forums > General Discussion > Off-Topic > The War Room


The War Room Gun-toting neocon? Tree-hugging lib? Duke it out in the War Room.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 04-10-2006, 06:17 PM   #1 (permalink)

Blue Belt
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 552
Extremely hot fires caused structures to fail, BYU expert says

This was on World Net Daily, which surprised me as they are, for the most part, neo-con ,adl loyal


Physicist says heat substance felled WTC

Extremely hot fires caused structures to fail, BYU expert says

By Suzanne Dean
For the Deseret Morning News
EPHRAIM — A Brigham Young University physicist said he now believes an incendiary substance called thermite, bolstered by sulfur, was used to generate exceptionally hot fires at the World Trade Center on 9/11, causing the structural steel to fail and the buildings to collapse.
"It looks like thermite with sulfur added, which really is a very clever idea," Steven Jones, professor of physics at BYU, told a meeting of the Utah Academy of Science, Arts and Letters at Snow College Friday.
The government requires standard explosives to contain tag elements enabling them to be traced back to their manufacturers. But no tags are required in aluminum and iron oxide, the materials used to make thermite, he said. Nor, he said, are tags required in sulfur.
Jones is co-chairman, with James H. Fetzer, a distinguished professor of philosophy at the University of Minnesota of Scholars for 9/11 Truth, a group of college faculty members who believe conspirators other than pilots of the planes were directly involved in bringing down New York's Trade Towers.
The group, which Jones said has 200 members, maintains a Web site at www.st911.org. A 40-page paper by Jones, along with other peer-reviewed and non-reviewed academic papers, are posted on the site.
Last year, Jones presented various arguments for his theory that explosives or incendiary devices were planted in the Trade Towers, and in WTC 7, a smaller building in the Trade Center complex, and that those materials, not planes crashing into the buildings, caused the buildings to collapse.
At that time, he mentioned thermite as the possible explosive or incendiary agent. But Friday, he said he is increasingly convinced that thermite and sulfur were the root causes of the 9/11 disaster.
He told college professors and graduate students from throughout Utah gathered for the academy meeting that while almost no fire, even one ignited by jet fuel, can cause structural steel to fail, the combination of thermite and sulfur "slices through steel like a hot knife through butter."
He ticked off several pieces of evidence for his thermite fire theory:
First, he said, video showed a yellow, molten substance splashing off the side of the south Trade Tower about 50 minutes after an airplane hit it and a few minutes before it collapsed. Government investigators ruled out the possibility of melting steel being the source of the material because of the unlikelihood of steel melting. The investigators said the molten material must have been aluminum from the plane.
But, said Jones, molten aluminum is silvery. It never turns yellow. The substance observed in the videos "just isn't aluminum," he said. But, he said, thermite can cause steel to melt and become yellowish.
Second, he cited video pictures showing white ash rising from the south tower near the dripping, liquefied metal. When thermite burns, Jones said, it releases aluminum-oxide ash. The presence of both yellow-white molten iron and aluminum oxide ash "are signature characteristics of a thermite reaction," he said.
Another item of evidence, Jones said, is the fact that sulfur traces were found in structural steel recovered from the Trade Towers. Jones quoted the New York Times as saying sulfidization in the recovered steel was "perhaps the deepest mystery uncovered in the (official) investigation." But, he said, sulfidization fits the theory that sulfur was combined with thermite to make the thermite burn even hotter than it ordinarily would.
Jones said a piece of building wreckage had a gray substance on the outside that at one point had obviously been a dripping molten metal or liquid. He said that after thermite turns steel or iron into a molten form, and the metal hardens, it is gray.
He added that pools of molten metal were found beneath both trade towers and the 47-story WTC 7. That fact, he said, was never discussed in official investigation reports.
And even though WTC 7 was not connected to the Trade Towers — in fact, there was another building between it and the towers —and even though it was never hit by a plane, it collapsed. That suggests, he said, that it came down because a thermite fire caused its structural steel to fail.
Jones said his studies are confined to physical causes of the collapses, and he doesn't like to speculate about who might have entered the buildings and placed thermite and sulfur. But he said 10 to 20 people "in the know," plus other people who didn't know what they were doing but did what they were told, could have placed incendiary packages over several weeks.
smedleyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 06:29 PM   #2 (permalink)

Brown Belt
 
icantstandit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: WAR ROOM WARRIORS!
Posts: 4,815
FYI- He is still the only guy out of 100s of experts that believes this, and this does support his theory that it was an "inside demolition job", although like most CTers, he fails to fill in the part about "who did it, why and how?"

His colleagues in the same department, all of them, don't agree with his assessment. He is most quoted conspiracy nut physicist, and BYU seems to be ashamed of him because they always make attach "BYU does not endorse Prof. Jones interpretation..."
__________________
icantstandit is The Bunny Slayer
icantstandit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 06:39 PM   #3 (permalink)

Blue Belt
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 552
That's cool, i personally don't have a clue what happened. But having read 75% + of the essay entitled Project for a New American Century, the "who may have done it" and "why" question certainly come into view. As far as the "how" goes, it more plausible than you think and much more believable than "how" did some terrorist guys execute some pretty impressive aeronautical skills.

And please don't label me with the "bush did it" moniker. That guy has problems making whole sentences, eating pretzels, and riding his bicycle.
smedleyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 06:45 PM   #4 (permalink)
Banned
 
flatline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: 604
Posts: 4,887
Quote:
Originally Posted by icantstandit
FYI- He is still the only guy out of 100s of experts that believes this, and this does support his theory that it was an "inside demolition job", although like most CTers, he fails to fill in the part about "who did it, why and how?"

His colleagues in the same department, all of them, don't agree with his assessment. He is most quoted conspiracy nut physicist, and BYU seems to be ashamed of him because they always make attach "BYU does not endorse Prof. Jones interpretation..."
Maybe because anyone of importance who has gone on record against the official story of 9/11 has been either discredited or been gagged by the courts, like the firefighters for instance.

I guess the guy's personal reputation overrides basic scientific laws, too, nothing to see here.
flatline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:16 PM   #5 (permalink)

Blue Belt
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 552
I'll bet BYU lost a few bucks in federal grants just because of him

[i]The strategic “transformation” of the U.S. military into an imperialistic force of global domination would require a huge increase in defense spending to “a minimum level of 3.5 to 3.8 percent of gross domestic product, adding $15 billion to $20 billion to total defense spending annually,” the PNAC plan said.

“The process of transformation,” the plan said, “is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event—like a new Pearl Harbor.”[/I "PROJECT FOR A NEW AMERICAN CENTURY"
smedleyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:24 PM   #6 (permalink)
Banned
 
InSummary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,871
SEARCH FUNCTION


this shit is mentioned in ALLLLL the other CT threads already. you idiots really dont bother going out of your way for anything do you?
InSummary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:29 PM   #7 (permalink)
Banned
 
InSummary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,871
Quote:
Originally Posted by flatline
Maybe because anyone of importance who has gone on record against the official story of 9/11 has been either discredited or been gagged by the courts, like the firefighters for instance.
liek these firefighters?

fire captain chris boyle:
Quote:
Boyle: ... on the north and east side of 7 it didn't look like there was any damage at all, but then you looked on the south side of 7 there had to be a hole 20 stories tall in the building, with fire on several floors. Debris was falling down on the building and it didn't look good.

... Then we received an order from Fellini, we're going to make a move on 7. That was the first time really my stomach tightened up because the building didn't look good. I was figuring probably the standpipe systems were shot. There was no hydrant pressure. I wasn't really keen on the idea. Then this other officer I'm standing next to said, that building doesn't look straight. So I'm standing there. I'm looking at the building. It didn't look right, but, well, we'll go in, we'll see. So we gathered up rollups and most of us had masks at that time. We headed toward 7. And just around we were about a hundred yards away and Butch Brandies came running up. He said forget it, nobody's going into 7, there's creaking, there are noises coming out of there, so we just stopped. And probably about 10 minutes after that, Visconti, he was on West Street, and I guess he had another report of further damage either in some basements and things like that, so Visconti said nobody goes into 7, so that was the final thing and that was abandoned.

Firehouse: When you looked at the south side, how close were you to the base of that side?

Boyle: I was standing right next to the building, probably right next to it.

Firehouse: When you had fire on the 20 floors, was it in one window or many?

Boyle: There was a huge gaping hole and it was scattered throughout there. It was a huge hole. I would say it was probably about a third of it, right in the middle of it. And so after Visconti came down and said nobody goes in 7, we said all right, we'll head back to the command post. We lost touch with him. I never saw him again that day.
and how about Fire chief Daniel Nigro: (haha, nigro)
Quote:
The biggest decision we had to make was to clear the area and create a collapse zone around the severely damaged [WTC Building 7]. A number of fire officers and companies assessed the damage to the building. The appraisals indicated that the building's integrity was in serious doubt.
and how about Deputy Chief Peter Hayden, Division 1 - 33 years:

Quote:
Hayden: ...also we were pretty sure that 7 World Trade Center would collapse. Early on, we saw a bulge in the southwest corner between floors 10 and 13, and we had put a transit on that and we were pretty sure she was going to collapse. You actually could see there was a visible bulge, it ran up about three floors. It came down about 5 o'clock in the afternoon, but by about 2 o'clock in the afternoon we realized this thing was going to collapse.

Firehouse: Was there heavy fire in there right away?

Hayden: No, not right away, and that's probably why it stood for so long because it took a while for that fire to develop. It was a heavy body of fire in there and then we didn't make any attempt to fight it. That was just one of those wars we were just going to lose. We were concerned about the collapse of a 47-story building there. We were worried about additional collapse there of what was remaining standing of the towers and the Marriott, so we started pulling the people back after a couple of hours of surface removal and searches along the surface of the debris. We started to pull guys back because we were concerned for their safety.
InSummary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:37 PM   #8 (permalink)
Banned
 
EnemyOfTheState's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Put your hands above your head!... it's a damned minigun!!! bang bang bang bang!!
Posts: 1,158
he is a distinquished professor in BYU. he does not give a fuck on all kinds of presures the university can do. all other professors are just pussys to say what they think: only extreme heat not the kerosin fire could pull the building.

WHY?
very obvious to attack any muslim oil rich country. this is why.

things like this happened in history: hitler burned reichstag and said comunists did it. this is how he won the elections.

CIA killed kenedy and said Aswald did it. and aswald is the comunist. lets continue vietnam war against comunists and avenge our presidents murder. Kenedy wanted to stop vietnam war.

these are just most gruesome examples. shit like this happens on smaller scale very often.
EnemyOfTheState is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:39 PM   #9 (permalink)
Banned
 
EnemyOfTheState's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Put your hands above your head!... it's a damned minigun!!! bang bang bang bang!!
Posts: 1,158
hey inSummary you start to really anoy me with your "fire cause the collapse".
buildings collapse from fire after weeks of burning.
EnemyOfTheState is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:39 PM   #10 (permalink)

Blue Belt
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 552
I posted it because it was on World Net Daily which i thought was interesting.

Also, using the search function brought back very little from the Government flavored CT crowd when it comes to PNAC at it's signifigance.
smedleyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




Latest Threads



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:46 PM.

Sherdog.com Forum Rules Clear Cookies Social Groups Lost Password

Skin made by Alex. © iStyles.uni.cc Powered by vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2009 Sherdog.com | Click here to advertise on Sherdog