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Go Back  Sherdog Mixed Martial Arts Forums > General Discussion > The War Room > "3 suspended for not standing for Pledge of Allegiance."

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Old 05-12-2008, 07:24 AM   #141 (permalink)

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I refuse to be grateful for things that are basic human rights and freedoms.
So dont. Whether they are basic or not, not every one has them.
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:32 AM   #142 (permalink)
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Why is it that the freedom that so many people are so eager to exercise is the freedom to be a douche bag? Stand up for a minute and then sit down. It's a simple gesture of respect.

Learn to pick your battles.
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:37 AM   #143 (permalink)

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were they jehovahs witness?
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Old 05-12-2008, 10:52 AM   #144 (permalink)

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Standing is in the rules, not reciting, and I don't think that's unreasonable. Standing is a sign of respect, not allegiance (that's what pledging would be). Disrespectful conduct of many kinds are against the rules in schools that would fall under the umbrella of 'protected free speech' for adults in life outside of the school. You don't have to listen to people in the real world when they lecture you, but ignoring the teacher in class is both disrespectful and against the rules. That's the way it is. School is about teaching professional conduct, and part of professional conduct is respecting other people and beliefs and following the rules. These kids failed on both counts, and were rightfully punished. Cry me a river for the school not respecting - on it's own grounds - the free speech of some punk kids who think they can act snotty and disrespectfully whenever and wherever they please. Consider this an important educational experience for the students, because such behavior WILL cost them in the real world.
your posts are always spot on.
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:13 AM   #145 (permalink)

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I refuse to be grateful for things that are basic human rights and freedoms.
there is no such thing has human rights or freedoms unless given you by a ruling government power... i'd be greatful if i were you. with out the united states government, this country is just a bunch of people murdering each other and stealing shit...

guess what keeps your neighbor from coming into your house stealing your TV and raping your wife... the government. oh you think its because he's a good person? he's not. he's fearful of his masters wrath. you are a dog. you obey your master and you like it that way, because your master keeps you fat and happy.

you should definitly be greatful that your government protects you from your very own neighbor... they provide garbage pickup, running water, roads to drive on... SAFE roads. countless things you take for granted that would not be here without your government... oh thats right... you could probably do without all those things.
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:24 AM   #146 (permalink)

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Jehovah's Witnesses & Religious Liberty

Pledging to the Flag (aftermath)

Although many Court opinions have provoked strong reactions, none have provoked such a wave of violence across the entire country. It is this which should, without question, demonstrate not only why the government should not get involved in either supporting or hindering religion, but why the government should not disparage any minority. By doing so, official sanction was given for people to vent anti-Witness feelings.

Hundreds of attacks were reported to the Justice Department in the two following years. Among the worst were the burning of a Kingdom Hall in Maine, police assisting a mob in Maryland in dispersing a Bible meeting, and nearly an entire town in Illinois attacking a group of Witnesses, which required calling in state police to protect them.

In West Virginia, a chief of police and deputy sheriff forced a group of Jehovah's Witnesses to drink large quantities of castor oil, tied them up with police department rope, and paraded them through town. In Nebraska, a Witness was kidnapped, beaten, and castrated. All of these acts - and many more like them - were traced directly back to the Gobitis ruling.

Justice Harlan Stone wrote a strongly-worded dissent to that ruling which became a primary basis of the reversal of this decision in West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette three years later. This time, Justice Jackson wrote the majority opinion, finding that the school district violated the rights of students by forcing them to salute the American flag.

Unlike the Court Decision in Gobitis, this Court did not declare that allowing an individual's rights to be supported over government authority is a sign of a weak government, and compulsion was not found to be legitimate means for creating national unity.

Jackson was also very clear that efforts to foster national unity through compulsion put minorities and dissenters at the mercy of "village tyrants" and "evil men," reflecting directly on the nation's recent experiences: "Those who begin coercive elimination of dissent soon find themselves exterminating dissenters. Compulsory unification of opinion only achieves the unanimity of the graveyard." Although those words were particularly relevant in 1943, they have lost none of their force.

This case is especially important because it underscores exactly what the Bill of Rights means. Justice Frankfurter had refused to protect First Amendment liberties against the actions of local government and electoral majorities. Justice Jackson, however, pointed out that that is exactly what the Bill of Rights exists for:

The very purpose of the Bill of Rights was to withdraw certain subjects from the reach of majorities and officials. One's right to worship, life, liberty, and property, to free speech, a free press, freedom of worship and assembly, and other fundamental rights may not be submitted to vote; they depend upon the outcome of no election.

We can thank religious minorities, and Jehovah's Witnesses in particular, for forcing the American court system to really deal with the concept of religious liberty. Because of them, our legal system was compelled to acknowledge that religious liberty existed for all people, not simply those who are part of sectarian majorities.

Jehovah's Witnesses and Religious Liberty
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Old 05-12-2008, 11:56 AM   #147 (permalink)

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Those little maggots need to understand that freedom ain't free.
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Old 05-12-2008, 12:00 PM   #148 (permalink)

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redneck
Wow.. you have got to be the most ignorant poster on SD.
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Old 05-12-2008, 12:01 PM   #149 (permalink)

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Wow.. you have got to be the most ignorant poster on SD.
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Old 05-12-2008, 12:02 PM   #150 (permalink)

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They should of just stood and mouthed the words and mentally have been ten million light years away like every other kid that has ever, or will ever, recite the pledge.
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