[Title Fight Productions]

Originally Posted by Sanin

Why is it that the most powerful nation on Earth has such an inferiority complex? No other free nation has the rituals our backwards ass nation has with its flag.

I guess thats what seperates us apart from the rest of the world as the only Super Power.

[MrJayDub]

Originally Posted by DrSatanDracula

MrJayDub:



I look forward to your name becoming MrJayDubs when you get them.

I already got 'em!

[Title Fight Productions]

Originally Posted by IronCage

I really don't understand why liberals are so much against the Pledge of Allegiance and always ready to defend "the right" to burn the flag.

I don't think they are againts it as much as they are for people having a right to pledge or not....and the flag burning is simply about freedoms!

[GermanBJJ]

Originally Posted by DaRuckus337

It's a free country, but schools aren't free institutions. Lots of things that are an expression of 'protected free speech' for adults in the outside world are against the rules in schools.

I usually agree with you, and I agree with your reasoning but I think I disagree with what we view as the proper roles of school in a society. I think schools should educate children. I think things such as respect, values, discipline, should come from the parents.

I don't want schools deciding to which values my child should conform. While I think most people agree that there are rules that schools have to enforce in order to function (like not talking while others are talking), those rules have a function other than simply instilling values.

Forcing children to stand for the pledge is a purely value-driven requirement and has little do with allowing the educational system to function properly.

But hopefully this child learned a valuable lesson: pick your battles.

[DaRuckus337]

It's not value driven at all. They aren't requiring that you pledge allegiance to the flag, they are requiring that you stand and show respect while others do. Everyone in this thread that 'agrees' with the students is making a serious error in reasoning and judgment. What they are actually feeling is that the pledge belongs in homes rather than schools (which is a separate debate). What they are saying, however, is that it is okay to be blatantly disrespectful to the beliefs and customs of others if they are not your own. That is the wrong message, and one that schools should be trying to actively discourage.

Cross-cultural respect and understanding is far more than mere manners and values - it is a vital part of professional and social interaction in the world that these students will enter in to some day. Students are supposed to be educated not only in math and science and English, but also in vital life skills like intelligent discourse, respectful problem solving, and openness to outside ideas. These are skills that are fundamental to a well-rounded education, and are absolutely necessary for anyone who wants to ever get a job or get along with others. This more rounded socio-intellectual education is why school systems are - in theory - superior to home schooling children or sitting them in front of an encyclopedia for 7 hours a day.

I don't know what the hell people here are thinking when they say it is appropriate for people to sit during foreign national anthems, or to not bow one's head and be quiet during a grace at another person's home, or to speak loudly when touring a cathedral during a service. The self-centered arrogance behind such actions is stunning to me, as is the ignorance that leads one to conclude that simply having a right makes something right. If you agree that it is important for schools to teach not only basic academic subjects, but also basic elements of constructive adult conduct, then I don't see how you can argue that the school is failing in it's duties when they punish students for blatant displays of disrespect towards the customs of their classmates and the school system.

[FoxTrot9R]

Originally Posted by Title Fight Productions

I guess thats what seperates us apart from the rest of the world as the only Super Power.

Lol well at least I dont have to go there now.

[KONG-D'SNT-TAP]

If you take a martial arts class you have to take your shoes off before you step on the mats and take class...

Before you start your school day you recite the pledge......

Try taking an entire martial arts class with your sneakers on, theyd also ask you to leave... I guess those indivduals are all conformist sheep as well.

[HuFlungPu]

Originally Posted by KONG-D'SNT-TAP

If you take a martial arts class you have to take your shoes off before you step on the mats and take class...

Before you start your school day you recite the pledge......

Try taking an entire martial arts class with your sneakers on, theyd also ask you to leave... I guess those indivduals are all conformist sheep as well.

Why is everyone missing the point? You're comparing apples and oranges.. how? What if that martial arts class asked you to take your shoes and give thanks to a religious figure... The pledge of allegiance is defied not because of it representing America - it's defied because of WHAT IT SAYS... One nation, under GOD... Yes you should be respectful to your country regardless of where you are. But religion is a VERY touchy subject these days.

It's like asking Native Americans to celebrate Columbus day or Thanksgiving when we all knew Columbus discovered America, but he ALSO slaughtered many indians.

[KONG-D'SNT-TAP]

Originally Posted by HuFlungPu

Why is everyone missing the point? You're comparing apples and oranges.. how? What if that martial arts class asked you to take your shoes and give thanks to a religious figure... The pledge of allegiance is defied not because of it representing America - it's defied because of WHAT IT SAYS... One nation, under GOD... Yes you should be respectful to your country regardless of where you are. But religion is a VERY touchy subject these days.

It's like asking Native Americans to celebrate Columbus day or Thanksgiving when we all knew Columbus discovered America, but he ALSO slaughtered many indians.

Actually you're missing the point... Actually you're reading much more into this than you should be..


Im not religious in the least but GOD doesnt equal catholocism... GOD is represenative of all religions not just one...

And for the atheists, to bad for them if they dont like the word God they just dont have to say that word... Case closed... Whats the problem..

The problem is people want to be difficult and stir a commotion because their bored....

[DaRuckus337]

Why can't people understand the difference between a rule requiring that people stand quietly out of respect and one that requires people to actually pledge along? The school board's rule simply asks for some acknowledgment of the tradition, not for active participation in it.