Making a School Decision

Tot@l_Recal| · 12-21-2006, 12:23 AM

Ok, it's always been a dream of mine to become a visual programmer for games. Sort of a childhood dream that carried into my mixed media art hobby and so on.

Here's my dilemma: I"ve decided to go back to school and I've currently got the choice between a bay area cal state school(Cal State East Bay) or a bay area private school (Art Institute of California - san francisco).

Cal State East Bay offers a regular computer science degree that's relatively a cheap school to pay for, but doesn't promise that I'll get into a lot of the visual stuff I want to do and doesn't promise any job placement.

A.I is a private school that has a degree that specializes in visual game programming and is considered one of the top schools in America for this type of thing. The con is that it'll leave me 80 grand in debt as opposed to the 30 grand in debt from Cal State East Bay. All of the vgp students from this school have been hired almost immediately though starting at around 50k which will go up quick with experience. It's not a brochure I'm reading either, I had a chance to sit down and talk to a lot of graduates and some of the gaming companies hiring these graduates.

Only slam on A.I. from the gaming companies themselves was that they didn't deem it necessary to have to go to an expensive private school like A.I. just to get a job like this (though it helps a lot ).

Should I go to East Bay and get a generalized comp. sci degree that gives more options, is less expensive, but doesn't necessarily get me where I want to go, or do I go to A.I and get the exact training I want, but with the hefty price tag that has near perfect career placement (but not completely perfect)?

__JaG__ · 12-21-2006, 12:27 AM

spend the money now for the education, it has the possibility to pay off. you'll always regret if you play it "safe" and wonder what could have been.

Tot@l_Recal| · 12-21-2006, 12:28 AM

good advice. I'm leaning towards the private school

Alcoholica · 12-21-2006, 12:31 AM

Go to the private school. It will be easy to pay off 80k with a good job, than pay off 30k with no job.

__JaG__ · 12-21-2006, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alcoholica

Go to the private school. It will be easy to pay off 80k with a good job, than pay off 30k with no job.

that's not really true. you have to be smart about it, know when it's too much. but it doesnt sound like the tuition is outa control....

oak99 · 12-21-2006, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tot@l_Recal|

Ok, it's always been a dream of mine to become a visual programmer for games. Sort of a childhood dream that carried into my mixed media art hobby and so on.

Here's my dilemma:

You have no dilemma. You know what you want, and you've found the place that makes it happen... Go to the specialized school.

The game industry is hard to break into, you need all the edge you can get. If you decide you want to be a generic programmer later on - it won't be hard to shift out of the game industry into something less specific. The reverse is very much not true.

One side note, working in the game industry (by most people's definition) sucks the ass. You work like a dog, the pay is not above average, and you will come to despise the games you helped create (due to incredibly repetitive tasks as well as not being able to implement the features you love). However, the people that love this industry... REALLY love this industry - so I say go for it.

Tot@l_Recal| · 12-21-2006, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oak99

You have no dilemma. You know what you want, and you've found the place that makes it happen... Go to the specialized school.

The game industry is hard to break into, you need all the edge you can get. If you decide you want to be a generic programmer later on - it won't be hard to shift out of the game industry into something less specific. The reverse is very much not true.

One side note, working in the game industry (by most people's definition) sucks the ass. You work like a dog, the pay is not above average, and you will come to despise the games you helped create (due to incredibly repetitive tasks as well as not being able to implement the features you love). However, the people that love this industry... REALLY love this industry - so I say go for it.

I"ve heard two sides to this story though. What are your sources on the "working like a dog" etc.?

oak99 · 12-21-2006, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tot@l_Recal|

I"ve heard two sides to this story though. What are your sources on the "working like a dog" etc.?

Friends and associates, probably a few dozen people over the years (meaning folks that I've had 'real' conversations with - not just casual talk). I've been in IT for about a decade, and the game industry is one of the holy grails for a lot of folks I've worked with - a bunch have made it. I also have several game companys as clients, so I talk to a lot of guys.

Many jobs in the IT field will work you like a dog, but most that do have the capacity to make you a ton of money if you stick it out (big 5 consulting firm). In gaming, you can be a star coder for your entire career, and you might not move up the money chain too far (there just isn't that much room for top dogs).

I have run across the other side of the story - but 9 out of 10 people report what I'm saying. The thing to remember, out of those 9 - I'd say about half of them LOVE the work, and talk about the hours like it is a freakin' job benefit not a drawback...

You have no dilemma. If you have a chance to truly love your job and to follow a dream, roll the dice. Again, even if you change your mind - that is a prestigious school and lots of creative/smart IT shops give a fair amount of respect to people who come from the game industry (not sure exactly why - there is a perception that it is a guru field - so "regular" IT guys give gaming guys a fair bit of default respect... the same applies to people like penetration testers or other high end infosec guys... they are the green berets of the lame-ass IT world... lol).

iwannafightu2 · 12-21-2006, 01:42 AM

i live in the bay area, is that robin williams in your av? what teh hell is east bay state. you mean Berkeley?

Tot@l_Recal| · 12-21-2006, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oak99

Friends and associates, probably a few dozen people over the years (meaning folks that I've had 'real' conversations with - not just casual talk). I've been in IT for about a decade, and the game industry is one of the holy grails for a lot of folks I've worked with - a bunch have made it. I also have several game companys as clients, so I talk to a lot of guys.

Many jobs in the IT field will work you like a dog, but most that do have the capacity to make you a ton of money if you stick it out (big 5 consulting firm). In gaming, you can be a star coder for your entire career, and you might not move up the money chain too far (there just isn't that much room for top dogs).

I have run across the other side of the story - but 9 out of 10 people report what I'm saying. The thing to remember, out of those 9 - I'd say about half of them LOVE the work, and talk about the hours like it is a freakin' job benefit not a drawback...

You have no dilemma. If you have a chance to truly love your job and to follow a dream, roll the dice. Again, even if you change your mind - that is a prestigious school and lots of creative/smart IT shops give a fair amount of respect to people who come from the game industry (not sure exactly why - there is a perception that it is a guru field - so "regular" IT guys give gaming guys a fair bit of default respect... the same applies to people like penetration testers or other high end infosec guys... they are the green berets of the lame-ass IT world... lol).

I was hoping to run into someone like you here. When you say inadequate pay, what pay scale are we talking here. I'm happy with 50k a year with possible promotion to 70k a year.