[bobbylight]

Sorry if this is a bit scatterbrained and drawn out.....If you want to just read my questions and answer them without any of the story or anything, they are bolded.

I quit drinking about a month ago, and I really feel better about it. I am only 21, and a lot of my friends don't know why I quit drinking, because I don't really have much of a problem with it, but I just thought it was the right thing to do. My real addiction was weed I guess, and I have stopped that for periods of time of up to 3 months but I always seem to come back to it, but I stopped that before new years. My friend is in rehab because he was on probation and couldn't stop smoking weed, and asked me to go to an AA meeting with him. A couple nights later he called me from a bar. Well next week when he asked me to go again I told him he can go by himself if he is just going to go to bars, and he pulled it "its not my fault, I'm addicted, I have no control over it" and I was just like "thats bullshit, you aren't like those people, you have control" and then he went on about how he was going to do his first step that night, saying about how he is powerless over the addiction.

As for how much I drank, maybe a few times a week, never when I really had something to do the next day, and I would never drive drunk, and I have never gotten into any trouble drunk, or even gotten into a fight. So really I don't have that much of a problem with it, but I just woke up one morning hung over and said "fuck this, I didn't even have much fun last night, I feel like shit, I don't need this anymore." And that was over a month ago and I haven't had a drink since, and really don't plan on picking it up again. I never really could control myself when I did drink though, so I know that I am either going to drink like that, or nothing at all, so I'm just going to drink nothing at all.

As for smoking weed, I started in 9th grade, smoked all through high school getting progressively worse until I was high the whole time I was awake every day. I would deal drugs even smuggle drugs over international borders so I had enough money and weed to smoke what I wanted . But I decided one year I really wanted to quit, so I went to rehab, and it helped me for a while, then after a few months I rationalized "hey, I can start smoking again, just not smoke often" and things like that, and within time I would get back into it every day. So I have done that probably 5 times, and this time I am going to be done for good (hopefully). And right now I have the girlfriend that will help me do it (even though she drinks quite a bit, and smokes weed on the occasion, just that she is there and I am not bored or anything, and I'm having sex and things, I really don't mind not getting fucked up.)

So basically I have two things to ask or comment about when it comes to AA. I personally think I am in control of my addictions, and I really think that everyone else is too. I mean I am not NEARLY as bad as some of the people in AA, and realize that they have a much harder time with it then myself, but I really think that everyone is in control of their addictions. But the only reason I am in control of my addictions is because I just choose to abstain completely, so maybe that means I'm not in control. I guess it just depends on how you look at it. And really the guys at the meeting made it seem that if I stopped going to the meetings, I would DEFINITELY relapse. So my first question is that if I am in control of my addictions (or at least have the control to abstain from them completely), am I really an addict or alcoholic?

Secondly, I feel as though AA doesn't give people enough credit. I think it works though because its like a brainwashing almost, and I think if people thought they had to do it all themselves they would give up, but now, since they are relying on a higher power, they feel that they have help. I think this works for most cases, but in my friends case I think it works against him. The reason being is that it was like he tried to pull that when he went to the bar and had a few drinks he really didn't feel like he was at fault. He blamed it on an addiction he was powerless to. And I was just like "thats fucking bullshit man, you decided to go to the fucking bar, it was your choice, not the addiction." I don't know, I'm just not sure that being preaching being powerless to your addiction is always a good thing.

On a side note I didn't realize how religious these things were. We said the our father at the end of the meeting!!!! That seemed pretty crazy to me. Even as a believer, 100%, it felt odd that such a big organization for getting sober depended on God. That IS a big part of myself getting sober, so I understand, and I feel like it brings people closer to God, which is a good thing, but what about the staunch atheist that wants to be sober. Someone like that MUST get turned off by the whole thing.

I guess thats what I have to say about AA and everything, I might have a few more questions later.

[Three Gun Fish]

AA comes from religion, and religion tells you what you are. You don't get to decide. AA works for some people, it doesn't work for everyone.

If you feel you are in control of your addictions, then you are not an addict. However, what you feel may be misleading, or a case of denial. That's the hard part about addiction -- admitting you have one.

AA is designed to break through these illusions. To reduce the member to point zero so he or she can start anew. You will hear horrific stories far beyond what you may think capable in your addiction. But the point is to give up everything in order to accept a new, sober path.

[bobbylight]

Originally Posted by Three Gun Fish

AA comes from religion, and religion tells you what you are. You don't get to decide. AA works for some people, it doesn't work for everyone.

If you feel you are in control of your addictions, then you are not an addict. However, what you feel may be misleading, or a case of denial. That's the hard part about addiction -- admitting you have one.

AA is designed to break through these illusions. To reduce the member to point zero so he or she can start anew. You will hear horrific stories far beyond what you may think capable in your addiction. But the point is to give up everything in order to accept a new, sober path.

Personally, I would call myself an addict, purely because I can't limit myself, when I am drinking, I drink too much, and when I am smoking I smoke WAYYYYY too much, so the only way I can control them is to abstain. But the people at the meetings make it seem that if I don't go to at least one meeting a week, then I won't be able to stay sober, which I think is wrong. I respect the people that do need meetings, but I personally don't feel that I do, but if I relapse at some point, then I will be in a meeting that week, and that is a definite. I just feel like what AA tells you is counterproductive to some (like my friend) who says things like "dude, you can relapse at any moment, its how addiction works" when in reality for me to relapse I would have to think about it and make the choice. This type of thinking actually seems to give him justification to relapse, because he "knows" in the back of his head that its not his fault, even though it is.

[Revolution]

I've mentioned this before, but visit www.rational.org. It rejects the AA model for many of the reasons you stated.
Oh, and good luck.

[edco76]

The success rate of addicts completing 12 step programs is actually lower than those using the "cold turkey" method. I don't buy the whole AA thing. I smoked weed, drank, and did meth for about 6 yrs. Weed and drinking everyday and usually atleast once a month go on atleast a 3-5 day meth binge. When I got married and had a child I went semi sober. Then I moved out of my home town and cleaned up. Got in church and never had any problems. I still drink quite often but only at home and I never get drunk. I would actually still smoke weed I think if it was legal. I really enjoyed it but It is not worth losing my children over or going to jail so I abstain. So..... addiction isn't a problem for me. I've done about every drug and had no problem knowing when to do them and when not. When it was time to stop. I stopped. Simple.

[bobbylight]

Originally Posted by edco76

The success rate of addicts completing 12 step programs is actually lower than those using the "cold turkey" method. I don't buy the whole AA thing. I smoked weed, drank, and did meth for about 6 yrs. Weed and drinking everyday and usually atleast once a month go on atleast a 3-5 day meth binge. When I got married and had a child I went semi sober. Then I moved out of my home town and cleaned up. Got in church and never had any problems. I still drink quite often but only at home and I never get drunk. I would actually still smoke weed I think if it was legal. I really enjoyed it but It is not worth losing my children over or going to jail so I abstain. So..... addiction isn't a problem for me. I've done about every drug and had no problem knowing when to do them and when not. When it was time to stop. I stopped. Simple.

Stories like this make me want to pick up drinking again. I have to fight the urge though. The reason being is that I have read stories about people that say they just don't drink as much as they used to and don't get drunk and its fine. I know that if I tried to do that it would eventually get to the point where I would get drunk again a few times a week. I don't like the taste of alcohol, and I only drank to get drunk. If I was ever buzzed, 99% of the time I wouldn't stop or want to stop until I was nice and drunk. I would usually be able to control myself by stopping before I was throwing up, but not by much.

[Revolution]

I've mentioned this before, but visit www.rational.org. It rejects the AA model for many of the reasons you stated.
Oh, and good luck.

[Revolution]

Sorry about the double post. I just don't know why that happens . . . .

[MrPissant]

I drink alot and a few months ago went to AA for a few weeks because last year for some reason I drank way too much.

All types of people were there. Upper, Middle and Lower class and I was shocked just how far some of them had gone with their drinking.

They were understanding with me because i didnt really have any "horror" stories from drinking, I'm just someone who likes to drink.

I don't drink at work, don't drink just to drink, I drink because I feel like it.

They called me a "functioning" alcoholic whatever the fuck that means. Anyway, 2 weeks worth of meetings helped me curtail mostly my drinking.

I now drink only socially and not so often. AA did give me suggestions on how to look at what drinking does to me and I keep that in mind now before I think about drinking.

I still drink, but about 80% less than I did.

So IMO that's progress.

[cheese7668]

Like anything else, AA has its good and its bad points.

What I do like about it is it gets people to admit they are addicted. Thats a huge thing. If you can just up and quit, you likely arent the type of person they are speaking to, you abuse the substance but arent addicted to it.

Also, people can say "powerless" and mean a bunch of different things. In my experience, people who are truly addicts are powerless in the sense that, once they have that first drink, they keep going until they are back where they started. That being said, they do have power in avoiding that first drink. The whole "powerless" thing also addresses people who think they dont need help but really do.

When they say that you are "always an addict" they are right in the sense that, for many of the people in AA, if, 10 years down the line they have a drink, they will often slip back to day 1. By going to the meetings and reinforcing that you are an addict and that you are powerless, it keeps the possibility of relapse at the front of your mind. If you get complacent and think you have "beat" your addiction, you will often (but not always) slip.

A lot of people misunderstand AA, and your friend seems to be one of them. They are often new members, and sometimes they enjoy looking at themselves as a victim. If they keep going, a lot of the time they realize what they are actually saying.

I've mentioned this before, but I unfortunately have experience dealing/living with real addicts. Once you have seen a true addict, you realize that some people who think they are addicts are really just abusers (who could become addicts), if that makes any sense.

That being said, their reliance on a "higher power" is one of my main problems with AA.