[Wolfcastle]

edited post

[masato@4nzix]

You know what else is weird?

Read the first few chapters of Ezekiel in the Bible.. what the hell is he describing there??

VERY odd:

Then I looked, and behold, a whirlwind was coming out of the north, a great cloud with raging fire engulfing itself; and brightness was all around it and radiating out of its midst like the color of amber, out of the midst of the fire. 5 Also from within it came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance: they had the likeness of a man. 6 Each one had four faces, and each one had four wings. 7 Their legs were straight, and the soles of their feet were like the soles of calves’ feet. They sparkled like the color of burnished bronze. 8 The hands of a man were under their wings on their four sides; and each of the four had faces and wings. 9 Their wings touched one another. The creatures did not turn when they went, but each one went straight forward.
10 As for the likeness of their faces, each had the face of a man; each of the four had the face of a lion on the right side, each of the four had the face of an ox on the left side, and each of the four had the face of an eagle. 11 Thus were their faces. Their wings stretched upward; two wings of each one touched one another, and two covered their bodies. 12 And each one went straight forward; they went wherever the spirit wanted to go, and they did not turn when they went.
13 As for the likeness of the living creatures, their appearance was like burning coals of fire, like the appearance of torches going back and forth among the living creatures. The fire was bright, and out of the fire went lightning. 14 And the living creatures ran back and forth, in appearance like a flash of lightning.
15 Now as I looked at the living creatures, behold, a wheel was on the earth beside each living creature with its four faces. 16 The appearance of the wheels and their workings was like the color of beryl, and all four had the same likeness. The appearance of their workings was, as it were, a wheel in the middle of a wheel. 17 When they moved, they went toward any one of four directions; they did not turn aside when they went. 18 As for their rims, they were so high they were awesome; and their rims were full of eyes, all around the four of them. 19 When the living creatures went, the wheels went beside them; and when the living creatures were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up. 20 Wherever the spirit wanted to go, they went, because there the spirit went; and the wheels were lifted together with them, for the spirit of the living creatures[c]was in the wheels. 21 When those went, these went; when those stood, these stood; and when those were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up together with them, for the spirit of the living creatures[d]was in the wheels.
22 The likeness of the firmament above the heads of the living creatures[e]was like the color of an awesome crystal, stretched out over their heads. 23 And under the firmament their wings spread out straight, one toward another. Each one had two which covered one side, and each one had two which covered the other side of the body. 24 When they went, I heard the noise of their wings, like the noise of many waters, like the voice of the Almighty, a tumult like the noise of an army; and when they stood still, they let down their wings. 25 A voice came from above the firmament that was over their heads; whenever they stood, they let down their wings.
26 And above the firmament over their heads was the likeness of a throne, in appearance like a sapphire stone; on the likeness of the throne was a likeness with the appearance of a man high above it. 27 Also from the appearance of His waist and upward I saw, as it were, the color of amber with the appearance of fire all around within it; and from the appearance of His waist and downward I saw, as it were, the appearance of fire with brightness all around. 28 Like the appearance of a rainbow in a cloud on a rainy day, so was the appearance of the brightness all around it.

[Wolfcastle]

Yes, Von Daniken had a theory about Ezekiel's vision as well, what he believed it to truly be...

[Wolfcastle]

'In his 1961 book Return to the Stars, von Daniken postulated that the Prophet Ezekiel's vision of the Divine Chariot, found in Chapter 1 of the Book of Ezekiel, was perhaps a spaceship, maybe even a "scout" vehicle. (Maybe someone was spying on the ancient Israelites going out to battle.)' (Ask the rabbi.com)

furthermore

Examples of Von Daniken’s “evidence” include:

· The Bible is full of stories best explained by assuming that the ancient Hebrews were in contact with extraterrestrials whom they worshipped as gods. (His ideas about the New Testament are not clear.)

· Intelligence seems to have appeared very suddenly in our ancestors about 40,000 years ago. They suddenly began using fire, bows and arrows, stone axes, and making sophisticated cave paintings.

· A map made by Turkish admiral Piri Re’is in 1513 is “perfectly accurate … [about] even the contours of the Antarctic, so that the originals must have been aerial photographs taken from a very great height” by extraterrestrials.

· In the Nasca Plain, a desert in Peru, there are enormous markings; they are only comprehensible if the desert had been used as a spacecraft landing field.

· The immense pyramids of Egypt could not have been constructed by primitive humans without help from extraterrestrials. He claims that “ancient Egypt appears suddenly and without transition with a fantastic ready-made civilization,”

· The statues of Easter Island could not have been made or raised by primitive men.

· Certain ancient works of art clearly show space ships and jet aircraft. One Mayan carving shows a “god” piloting a rocket ship complete with acceleration couch, instrument panel, and exhaust flames.

· The space gods dug gigantic tunnel systems under Ecuador and Peru, where they stored fantastic gold treasures offered them by primitive natives.

· The myths of all cultures concerning their gods are distorted memories of extraterrestrials on the ancient earth.

None of this “evidence” is valid. For a detailed analysis of von Daniken’s claims, consult books in the reference list. There is space here for just a few brief comments.

One of von Daniken’s favorite ploys is to give a “gadget” explanation for everything in a selected myth. This interpretation is always based on our own present technology and not the hypothetical super advanced technology of extraterrestrial space travelers. Thus, the Ark of the Covenant was a radio transmitter/receiver (or a nuclear reactor). Aladdin’s lamp was also a radio. Sodom and Gomorrah were devastated by a nuclear explosion. Ezekiel’s wheel was a helicopter. The absurdity of this device can be shown by making up your own “gadget” explanations for everything mentioned in the Bible. The flaming sword used by the angel to bar Adam and Eve from Eden was doubtlessly a flamethrower or perhaps a soldering iron. Jonah’s whale was a submarine. The pillar of fire was a streetlight (or a MacDonald’s sign); the raising of Lazarus, an application of heart massage; Ezekiel’s vision, a TV. commercial! This is philistine provincialism, not evidence."

[masato@4nzix]

yeah Von Daniken was a fruitcake.. he brought up lots of interesting facts, but spun such wild theories around them without any form of empirical structure whatsoever..

But the oddities he points to are still oddities nonetheless.. like the first book of Ezekiel.. you can theorize whatever you like, but the bottom line is that is it very strange writings for someone of that time.

[Mr.Totality]

there are many of these paintings, the question that needs to be answered is, if these "beings" were coming here so frequently and it was acceptedd, why have they stopped?

[NHB7]

Originally Posted by Mr.Totality

there are many of these paintings, the question that needs to be answered is, if these "beings" were coming here so frequently and it was acceptedd, why have they stopped?

Well there is a big long story about it in a book called the twelth planet and also on a website listed in another thread on this forum. They make interesting points, but after a while they do something that a lot of religions do as well, they expect you to make a lot of assumptions. They also take some weak evidence and use words like "obvious" to make it seem like strong evidence. But this is the general story given in that book:

The Sumerians sort of appeared with advances that seemed to have no precursory. That is true. Before the sumerians we were cave and thatch hut dwellers. It was just before this rise that there are some cave paintings of weird creatures, see above. The story is that Aliens from planet x (a planet yet to be discovered in our own solar system and because of a bizarre gravitational pull on the outer most planets, many astronomers to consider the existence of another planet quite possible) came to earth. The people of this planet mined the earth for gold in the middle east and northern Africa. The minors at some point rebelled due to the conditions in the caves. So the aliens came up with the concept of cross breeding their own DNA with Homo erectus which lead to the creation of humans (some people that believe in this story say that this is why early followers of these so called God's say "We were created in his image.") These people lived in the first major cities in Sumeria, and they did the Gods (aliens) dirty work. However eventually the humans started to breed and spread out too much. The aliens tried to stop this by wiping most of them out by creating a huge flood in the middle east, but it was too late because humans had already spread too far.

It was at this point that the Annukai (the summerian name for the Gods) from Nuburi (Sp?) the place the Summerian gods came from broke into two factions. One sympathized with humans and no longer thought they should be enslaved and even began having relations with the humans. the other group thought this was somewhat gross and immoral. The two factions fought amongst this issue so much that it was decided they would simply agree to leave the planet.

However another explanation for their leaving is that they are unable to travel very far in their space craft. They would not be able to travel all the way from past pluto until to earth. For this reason, some suspect their planet has an eliptical orbit. Stitchen, a linguist who can read several antient languages has translated stone tablets and has come to the conclusion that the Annukai's planet has an eliptical orbit that travels around the sun once every 3600 earth years. Thus they will be close enough to the earth to travel to it every 3600 years.

thats the basic story from my understanding. I have trouble believing it, but if you read the evidence they believer supply some of it is interesting a lot of it is too much of a reach.

[Mr.Totality]

I know about the book 12th planet. It was interesting with some thought provoking evidence.

However, my concern is over wolfcastle's last post. While many of von daniken's claims are preposterous, specifically Lord Pacal's tomb, others are interesting, namely the egyptian pyramid and the Piri Reis map. Go search for the map and you will see what I mean. I think what this truly leads us to is the legend of Atlantis and the early civilizations, and that civilization is much older on this planet than we realize

[NHB7]

Originally Posted by Mr.Totality

I know about the book 12th planet. It was interesting with some thought provoking evidence.

However, my concern is over wolfcastle's last post. While many of von daniken's claims are preposterous, specifically Lord Pacal's tomb, others are interesting, namely the egyptian pyramid and the Piri Reis map. Go search for the map and you will see what I mean. I think what this truly leads us to is the legend of Atlantis and the early civilizations, and that civilization is much older on this planet than we realize

I do believe that it is very possible that there were older civilizations. There does seem to be intriguing evidence that certain egyptian monuments may be much older than we think, but unfortunately the Egyptian government is set on not exploring those possibilities any further. I don't blame them, I mean they have a good thing going for them by being able to say they come from one of the most enginious ancient cultures of all time. Why would they want to find out that most of the amazing parts of their culture were actually put their by a totally different more ancient culture.

Anyway, as much as I don't like global warming and don't want to see the ice caps melt, I'm curious to see what we find in Antarctica if that ice melts away and it doesn't lead to some catastophic apocolypse.

[soul.controler]

yeh i think the lost atlantis civilisation is in antarctica, I read one of the oldest texts from egypt where a god claims he traveled up from a lost city that was flooded and wowd all the people around egypt with his technology to creat the egyptian civilisation. I also heard that back then there wouldnt have been ice over antarctica because of the magnetic poles being shifted in different positions and that they have found ancient maps which seem to be liked to antarctica without the ice, havnt read up on these tho