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Supreme Overlord of All Ramba
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Hovering directly above you
Posts: 5,345
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The Official Machida Sub-forum
*** UPDATE ON 7.28.08****
Well, we know now that Machida's next opponent is Thiago Silva. I think, personally, that the winner of that fight will be slated to face the winner of Chuck vs Rashad, and that the winner of that fight will then have a crack at the title.
I think that Machida will be able to beat Thiago Silva. I don't think that Thiago is going to be able to bully his way inside, and even if he does, I don't think that he'll be able to take Machida down and keep him down in order to go to his specialty area...the GnP.
I see Machida taking this fight via UD in a very technical and beautiful fight that many will call "boring".
However, after Chuck beats Rashad (I don't think that Rashad has anything for Chuck at all), then I think we'll see a Machida vs Chuck fight.
THAT is the fight that I can't wait to see...and one that I really can't call a winner for. They are both counter-strikers. If Machida plays Chuck's game, he's going to get KOed. However, Rampage and Jardine both showed us the holes in Chuck's game and gave other fighters insight into how to beat him. If Machida can be patient and careful against Chuck, and not give in to the desire to be "exciting" and over-commit, then I think that he has a chance to UD chuck as well.
****** END UPDATE******
I have been a huge Machida supporter for a very long time, and have been saying for years that he is going to be a world champion one of these days. There have been a lot of threads about Machida since the last UFC and new fans discovering him. However, there are a few very specific things about him that I would like to present for discussion that have been largely overlooked:
1. His fighting style is very much traditional karate based in its strategy and execution. Like Cung Le, for example, here is a fighter that brings a traditional martial art into the ring and makes it work. This is a very important aspect of his game that has ramifications beyond just Machida as a fighter....it challenges a number of assumptions that we have had about TMA's since MMA changed our outlook.
During his last fight, right before he dropped Soko for the final time that lead to the submission, Rogan commented that Soko "is being sucked in my Machida. He's getting mesmerized by what Machida is doing". I thought that was a very interesting and accurate assessment of how Machida fights and how his style works.
Additionally, as a fighter you cannot make even the smallest mistake when fighting him, because he gives 0 % for your margin of error. He pressures opponents not by being aggressive and bum rushing them, but by constantly pressing them to make mistakes; By frustrating them into being over aggressive or try to push too hard in response to his style....and if Machida has shown anything, it is that if you make even the slightest mistake against him (even mistakes that are so small that you can only see it in slo-motion replay), he's going to immediately capitalize and make you pay.
2. Because of his style, he takes very little damage in every single fight, even though most of his fights have gone to decision (and this has to do, in large part, with his karate-based stand-up style). In taking so little damage in his fights, his longevity as a fighter is greatly increased. For example, look at Wandy...his fighting style has caused him to take a lot of damage in his fights over the years, and whereas he's a great fighter and one of the greatest 205ers ever, I truly believe that the damage he's taken over the years has significantly shortened the life of his career.
3. Watching Machida fight is like watching a work of art by Matisse or Picasso....it's value is not immediately apparent without the proper background and education in what you are seeing. Unlike watching Wandy or Chuck throw hard leather, which virtually anyone with very little experience or education can appreciate, with Machida you need a certain understanding of context, technique, and interpretation in order to appreciate and understand what you are seeing and why it's important.
*EDIT*
In response to people's comments in other threads, I'd like to add this:
Some have accused us Machida fans of being "Elitist" because we "assume" that if you don't like Machida, then you're not a true MMA fan, or you are ignorant and uneducated about the fight game. In response to that, I would like to say that:
First off, I would never say that anyone wasn't a true MMA fan because of their fighter preferences. That's just rude and wrong.
(However, I DO say that about the bozos who make threads ranting about how the ground fighting is boring and should be removed from MMA, or the rules should be changed to minimize the ground game.)
However, in terms of the second point, I would say that if a person really understands and appreciates what they are seeing in a fighter like Machida, then a person wouldn't say "He's boring" or some other such stuff.....they would bring a reasoned argument like "I appreciate what he does, but my particular preference is for fighters that do x and y, etc."
To go back to the Art analogy: Do I personally love Monet's work? Not really....I would never put reprints of his stuff up in my home. However, I cannot look at his work and say "it's boring" or put it down or discredit it just because it's not to my personal taste because I understand WHY his works are masterpieces and are so important.
So, I'm not saying that if you personally don't care for his style, you're ignorant. Rather, you can tell those who ARE ignorant by the way that they critique his style.
4. Therefore, I think that not only is Machida important because his fighting style is challenging assumptions and generally indicative of a paradigm shift in how we think about TMA's in MMA, but also because I believe that he's going to have a very long and influential career, and that career is going to cause many fans to educate themselves further into the nature of the art, and serve as the catalyst for a deeper discussion about technique, style, and execution in MMA.
**Post Tito-Fight EDIT**
In this fight, what we saw was that Machida was simply better than Tito at every phase of the game:
1. In the free-motion phase (striking) he controlled the fight and dealt out 90% of the damage while taking very little damage himself.
2. In the clinch and up against the cage he controlled Tito very well.
3. He stuffed nearly all of Tito's TD attempts and even took Tito down a couple of times.
4. On the ground he controlled Tito and nearly stopped the fight with elbows from side control. Tito got saved by the bell, but if the round hadn't ended, the fight was about 10 seonds away from a stoppage, IMO.
5. Aside from a slick triangle that was countered with a beautiful escape, Tito had NOTHING for Machida on the ground.
What I find very interesting here is that Machida's style...the counter-fighting style of constant motion, creating angles and waiting for your opponent to enter, then moving in, hitting very quickly, and getting out; as well as the strategy of waiting for your opponent to make small mistakes and then immediately moving in, capitalizing on that mistake, and then disengaging, is classic Karate from Kumite and full contact sparring.
Machida uses this very effectively, and SO DOES CHUCK LIDDEL. However, when Chuck moves in, he can afford to stand in front of his opponent and swing more punches because he has such huge KO power. Machida does not have that KO power, so he moves out and disengages much faster because he knows he doesn't have the luxury of standing in front of his opponent like Chuck does.
However, in both of their styles, you can very clearly see the Karate background and influence of both fighters. For example, Chuck does this thing that only he does, and does it very well; he stands right over downed opponents and hits them from a standing position....and he does it all the time, and in a position that no other fighters really do. That particular style is right out of KaJuKenBo, which is the style that Hackelman's lineage comes from, and which is very common in Kempo.
In watching Machida fight, we are literally witnessing the next evolution of MMA; Fighters like Chuck, Machida, and Cung Le are literally bringing the traditional martial arts back into the ring and making them work.
That's it. Any comments or anything to add would be appreciated.
Thanks
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Officially Driving the Machida Jungle Karate Bandwagon:
Machida by Tatsumaki sempu-kyaku!!!
Last edited by Rambamatic; 07-28-2008 at 12:02 PM.
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