Why do people "Hate" on Judo?

[Q mystic]

Originally Posted by S. Carter

Q, why don't you enlighten us some as to why you think judo is the best base for mma?

I thought I was.

[georgejjr]

Nevermind, someone else covered it much better

[georgejjr]

Originally Posted by Judoka89

Check the records.

It's

1. Japan
2. France
3. Korea

I checked, and you're right. The Sov-Russia is only 4th in overall gold medals in judo world championships. Guess I'm prejudiced because I'm a heavyweight, and that's where most of their medals are, never really noticed they didn't do as well in lighter divisions. It's also confusing because a lot of the former Soviet bloc are now countries in their own right, which I guess I still (mistakenly) think of as Russia. My bad

[georgejjr]

Originally Posted by Q mystic

I liked in your other post where you had 'judo for jacket and wrestling for none and the diff was damn small'.

I agree in nogi comp like sport grappling and wrestling, but don't you think the favor shifts somewhat for judo in mma where the standup clinch is more prevelant? Especially considering(not big, but edge) that a judo will be more opt to fight from back.

Hm, three posts in a row ... have to love being sick with the flu. I agree if you're comparing judo and freestyle in that judo is more standup/clinch based, but don't forget Greco-Roman is also a kind of wrestling, and it's very clinch based. Having said that, most wrestler do either freestyle or GR, so maybe we should be comparing all three of them rather than lumping GR and freestyle into wrestling.

[Q mystic]

Originally Posted by georgejjr

Hm, three posts in a row ... have to love being sick with the flu. I agree if you're comparing judo and freestyle in that judo is more standup/clinch based, but don't forget Greco-Roman is also a kind of wrestling, and it's very clinch based. Having said that, most wrestler do either freestyle or GR, so maybe we should be comparing all three of them rather than lumping GR and freestyle into wrestling.

I like GR but think that the lack of leg attacks is way too detrimental. They crosstrain in freestyle and viceverse but when you see ouchi or k/osoto from wrestlers in nogi mma you see a diff I think. Control it seems.

Havent seen an uchimata from a wrestler yet and many more wrestlers in mma.

3 posts. If your not having fun....which is what this is to me. Substance>...

[GuardGame]

Originally Posted by Q mystic

Not 1st but he promotes his sambo yes. I posted a response after that regarding this and was more fair.

GG, when you gonna get you some judo? Your only 17, young enough.

Right now Im wrestling at my high school, not competing..just taking wrestling as a class. But I wont be able to compete and train with the wrestling team when wrestling season starts as I am committed to helping my instructor with teaching kids classes, beginner classes, soon womens classes.

There is a Judo black belt that trains with us and I work with him a lot. Maybe I'll start taking Judo classes when or after I graduate, thats when I'll have some cash to spend.

After I graduate, I hope to move down to Brazil for 6 to 18 months, depending on what lifestyle I end up living down there. I wanna be doing BJJ and a takedown art while Im down there..So, we'll see what happens..

[themaiden]

Originally Posted by S L A M

Ever heard of Ad Santel?

you need to read the whole thread...

[Mr. KiLo]

Originally Posted by georgejjr

The difference between sambo and judo is pretty fuzzy at best, especially in Russia. Most of the top people compete in both (even Japanese judo champs have competed and won in the world sambo championships). You won't find a single Russian champ in either judo or sambo who hasn't done both extensively, they're pretty much synomonous.

As for Fedor, he started both simultaneously (in Russia they're taught together). He was a member of the Russian national judo team (the 2nd best team in the world for heavyweights, and had a chance to go to the olympics (which he decided against because he correctly decided he'd make more doing MMA).

Anyone who's ever been at the level to go to the olympics in any sport, especially for an international power at that sport, will assure you they've put a lot of effort into that sport. No one gets on a national team without a great base in the sport they're in. Saying Fedor was on the Russian national judo team without a good base in judo is as silly as saying Dan Gable was on the American national wrestling team without a good base in freestyle wrestling because he did folkstyle rather than freestyle as a kid.

However, his primary focus is now sambo (in which he still competes) rather than judo. Though again, sambo's throws and takedowns are from judo, as are its armlocks (it doesn't have chokes, his chokes are completely based on judo), so this is almost semantics. Talk to Russians about this, they'll think the question is silly. Samboa and judo in Russia is like folkstyle and freestyle wrestling in the US.

I agree with most of what you are saying, but I am going to quote something I said in another thread about this same issue.

Also, you are right about Fedor as he has a master of sport in both Sambo and Judo. But his Combat Sambo background also has a lot to do with his success in MMA. Also, I have suspicions that Fedor trained in Russian Martial Art (Systema), particularly because of the elliptical over hooks he throws.

Originally Posted by Mr. KiLo

Judo and Sambo are not the same thing, although they share many similarities. Sambo is Slavic wrestling styles combined with Judo/ju jitsu, and a lot of other influences (including Oriental striking arts like Kung Fu and Karate in Combat Sambo). When Sambo was originally created in the Soviet Union, the people charged with creating the new style had very diverse backgrounds in martial arts, from Judo to Karate to Kung Fu etc because Sambo was created to be used for many purposes, including military training and for "one national style of competitive wrestling" concurrent with Soviet thinking at the time. That's why in sport Sambo there are other forms of takedowns taken from freestyle/greco roman. However, you are correct in saying they are similar in competitions and Sambo grapplers have good success in judo and vice versa, but they still have different rules/uniforms/customs that affect the grappling itself. For example, there are no gi bottoms in Sambo and there is a huge emphasis on leg locks (illegal in judo), whereas Judo has a much looser "jacket" that can be used for chokes and strangles (which are illegal in sambo), etc etc

But in the end, the emphasis in both sambo and judo is put on throws for points and submissions.

[greatmuta]

Because most of sherdoggers here are uneducated BJJ nuthuggers.

[Mr. KiLo]

Originally Posted by georgejjr

Hm, three posts in a row ... have to love being sick with the flu. I agree if you're comparing judo and freestyle in that judo is more standup/clinch based, but don't forget Greco-Roman is also a kind of wrestling, and it's very clinch based. Having said that, most wrestler do either freestyle or GR, so maybe we should be comparing all three of them rather than lumping GR and freestyle into wrestling.

Isn't greco-roman part of freestyle?

Also, I wanted to ask you: what's the difference between Russian Judo and other types of Judo? I've read somewhere that there is actually a style of Judo called Russian Judo.