Chuck. Randy, Hughes: How Do They Fair?

speakhandsforme · 01-05-2009, 11:59 PM

Alright, I wanted to get everybody's perspective on the futures/potentials of the MMA stars that have recently been seen as declining in age: Chuck Liddell, Randy Couture, Matt Hughes, Tito Ortiz, Frank Shamrock, Wanderlei Silva, and Shogun.

Say whether you think the fighter is top ten in his respective division and/or whether he's a title contender.

Chuck Liddell - Though I think that Chuck is universally one of the less skilled fighters of the bunch, he still prevents matchup problems for many fighters and has only been dominated by one fighter: Rampage Jackson. If he can improve his physical shape, I still think he can have a good string of fights.
Verdict: Top Ten? Yes.........Title Contender? Yes

Randy Couture - I was never sold on his legitimacy as a a top five heavyweight, despite his two impressive wins. But, not having won a fight in a year and a half, I don't have to validate those opinions. I don't see him ever being able to beat Brock or Nogueira.
Verdict: Top Ten? Yes..........Title Contender? No

Matt Hughes - Aside all the bustle about how he has refused to change his game, he has yet to lose to a fighter outside the p4p top ten. The fact that he won a round against Thiago Alves proves that he isn't completely outclassed. Until he loses to a fighter that isn't the caliber of Alves or GSP, he's still the fighter that is only two years removed from having recent wins over BJ Penn and Frank Trigg.
Verdict: Top Ten? Yes..........Title Contender? Yes

Tito Ortiz - Though he has always claimed top ten talent and has posted winning performances against the UFC's current and former LHW champs, he could no longer win in a UFC where skilled wrestlers/athletes are now refining other martial arts. You can still be a top ten....but he has to fight some day which doesn't seem likely with his new business interests.
Verdict: Top Ten? No..........Title Contender? No

Frank Shamrock - Franky is the hardest to determine out the fighters due to the fact that we haven't seen a healthy and committed Shamrock fight since 1999. Though he has no wins to claim a top ten spot, people close to the sport maintain that he has actually improved some skills and can still be a very competetive MW.
Verdict: Top Ten? No..........Title Contender? Yes (if he were in a major org)

Wanderlei Silva - Silva's spot is dependent on his weight division. His developing flaw seems to be his slowed reflexes...the worst part of that, however, is that MW's tend to be faster than LHW's. Though I can't see him ever competing for a belt, he hasn't had any losses that can kick him out of the top level.
Verdict: Top Ten? Yes..........Title Contender? No

Shogun Rua - It only took one upset loss for fans to write the Brazilian off as "overrated," but, in reality, he has no other real denotations, outside of a veiled injury, that he is any less the fighter. But, he hasn't won a fight in almost two years, and not against a legitimate LHW since Arona in 2005, so you can't class him as a top ten right now. Luckily, he's young and talented.
Verdict: Top Ten? Yes ..........Title Contender? Yes

tovar · 01-06-2009, 12:02 AM

shogun's hardly done, i don't get how anyone can says he's over-rated. Holding consecutive wins over page, rogerio, overeem and arona is pretty fuckin impressive

jeff corwin3000 · 01-06-2009, 12:06 AM

Shoguns only 27 years old so I would remove him from the list entirely.

The Shamrock situation is certainly interesting but I would give him a no for both.

Don Juan · 01-06-2009, 12:22 AM

I like this thread... I disagree with your Hughes analysis though... He was the peak of talent then and now the peak of talent has skyrocketed especially in that division.

mkess101 · 01-06-2009, 12:27 AM

If Hughes managed to regain the WW title I would be flat out SHOCKED.

He MIGHT still be a top 10 WW, but I can't see him beating GSP, Alves, Kos, or Fitch. He had his run (and it was a great one), but the sport has passed him by (at least at the elite, top-tier level).

speakhandsforme · 01-06-2009, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkess101

If Hughes managed to regain the WW title I would be flat out SHOCKED.

He MIGHT still be a top 10 WW, but I can't see him beating GSP, Alves, Kos, or Fitch. He had his run (and it was a great one), but the sport has passed him by (at least at the elite, top-tier level).

If GSP were to vacate the division, I could see him beating any other WW. He just has to join a top camp...which he won't. He still has MMA wrestling as good or better than Kos and definitely Fitch...and his BJJ is better than those two as well. He just needs to invest in the Randy Couture style dirty standup.

mkess101 · 01-06-2009, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speakhandsforme

If GSP were to vacate the division, I could see him beating any other WW. He just has to join a top camp...which he won't. He still has MMA wrestling as good or better than Kos and definitely Fitch...and his BJJ is better than those two as well. He just needs to invest in the Randy Couture style dirty standup.

One of the problems Hughes now faces is that guys have just gotten so much bigger at that weight class. And Hughes' striking is so bad he often can't get close enough to think about using his wrestling against the elite guys.

I just don't see him at this point in his career (nearing the end) rededicating himself to rounding out his game.

Oh, and I think he'd get thrown around by Kos right now. Maybe I'm wrong, but I have a hard time seeing Hughes outwrestle Kos.

SeattleFightFan · 01-06-2009, 12:41 AM

be careful counting Randy out; last fight be damned.

Shogun we simply don't know. he's a young pup with a bunch of bad injuries; he could go Mir style or Terrell style.

the rest are a sound no.