P4P Debate

patMANpv · 10-01-2008, 09:50 PM

This whole P4P debate just needs to end.

We got 4 guys at the top of the list and each one of them has their own argument for/against why they should/shouldn't be the P4P best. Claiming one person is unquestionable #1 does nothing but spark the same debate that has been going on over the past 6 months.

FACTS ABOUT THE P4P BEST:
Fedor
Fedor has dominated everyone he has fought, the same cannot be said for the others on this list. Fedor has fought just about everyone possible. He beat Nogueira twice, destroyed Sylvia, tried to fight Randy, beat Cro Cop.... Not to mention Fedor is a fairly small HW. The thing working against Fedor is the fact that he is the heaviest on this list, and the fact that his resume as of late isn't as impressive as the others.

Anderson Silva
No one has been as dominant as of late as Anderson Silva. Anderson has completely dismantled the MW division since joining the UFC. He has finished every one of his fights and has left no question as to who the best MW in the UFC really is. He also jumped up to LHW and made quick work of James Irvin. There are no signs that Silva will slow down anytime soon. However, Silva has looked less than impressive on the ground on several occasions since joining the UFC. Also, he has some very damaging losses to some inferior opponents before he joined the UFC.

GSP
Georges St. Pierre dominated the most decorated WW of all-time not once but twice. He has out-wrestled some of the best wrestlers in MMA (Hughes, Koscheck, Fitch). He's beaten one of the other P4P best, BJ Penn. GSP's resume at 170 is ridiculously impressive, so many top fighters have been destroyed by him. However, GSP got KOed by an unranked WW he was supposed to destroy (Serra). He has also looked less than stellar on several occasions (first Hughes fight, first round with BJ). The fight with BJ should tell us a lot.

BJ
BJ has one of the most compelling arguments for the P4P title, since he has actually gone outside his natural weight class and had success (won the WW title, 3-0 at 185). BJ has also completely dominated his weight class, steamrolling through top talent early on in his career, and absolutely demolishing Jens, and Stevenson, and KOing Sherk. He also beat Takanori Gomi convincingly, the widely regarded #2 LW. BJ is also the lightest fighter on this list which helps his cause. BJ has a lot of losses on his record however, including one to fellow P4P contender GSP. The rematch with GSP will give us a good indication of how great BJ really is.

Anyway, that is my simple opinion on the matter. I do not think we can crown any of these guys as the #1 P4P fighter, since it is simply a matter of opinion and there are arguments for and against all of them.

What do you guys think?

mycorona135 · 10-01-2008, 09:52 PM

i think this thread will get deleted... but there really is no way to determine top p4p fighters its all opinion...

patMANpv · 10-01-2008, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mycorona135

i think this thread will get deleted... but there really is no way to determine top p4p fighters its all opinion...

Ya probably, just had to get my two cents out there though

Jack V. Savage · 10-01-2008, 10:01 PM

How does GSP get mentioned with those three, and where is Kid, Torres, and Faber? Machida and Nog also deserve to be part of the conversation.

Jack V. Savage · 10-01-2008, 10:02 PM

Double.

Jack Bauer · 10-01-2008, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack V. Savage

How does GSP get mentioned with those three, and where is Kid, Torres, and Faber? Machida and Nog also deserve to be part of the conversation.

Why wouldn't he. He's top's in division dominance on Fight Matrix. He has beaten a bunch of TOP 10 fighters in his division.

Machida is excellent but hasn't won a belt or beaten a number 1 guy yet, and Nog is definitely up there but he's lost twice to Fedor twice and Barnett. He's a great fighter no doubt. Georges is a little more dominant and actually on top of his weight class without a doubt. Serra knocked GSP out, but I think the fluke of it was GSP's mental state.........he looked terrible and unfocused. I don't think we'll ever see that again. Nog almost got knocked out by Herring, so really it can happen to anybody.

Except BJ "fuckin" Penn. Apparently he cannot.

patMANpv · 10-01-2008, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack V. Savage

How does GSP get mentioned with those three, and where is Kid, Torres, and Faber? Machida and Nog also deserve to be part of the conversation.

Just addressing the top 4 guys on most people's lists...

Jack V. Savage · 10-01-2008, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Bauer

Why wouldn't he. He's top's in division dominance on Fight Matrix. He has beaten a bunch of TOP 10 fighters in his division.

Machida is excellent but hasn't won a belt or beaten a number 1 guy yet, and Nog is definitely up there but he's lost twice to Fedor twice and Barnett. He's a great fighter no doubt. Georges is a little more dominant and actually on top of his weight class without a doubt. Serra knocked GSP out, but I think the fluke of it was GSP's mental state.........he looked terrible and unfocused. I don't think we'll ever see that again. Nog almost got knocked out by Herring, so really it can happen to anybody.

Belts mean nothing in p4p terms. And, yes, Nog lost to Fedor and Barnett. No shame in that. Losing to Serra is considerably worse, even if his fans want to ignore it. And almost getting KOd isn't quite as bad in my estimation as getting KOd. I don't put any stock in Fight Matrix or Fight Metric at all.

I Hate You · 10-01-2008, 10:34 PM

There is no debate. BJ Penn is the answer.

hughes fan · 10-03-2008, 02:12 PM

there will never be an end because most of them can't cut weight and fight each other and an openweight fight would kind of be missing the point