[King Kabuki]

My lid blew off when I shook it up. Shit went everywhere.

Is that your excuse for why your log isn't updated?

Booooo.

[Chad Hamilton]

I've just have been lazy with the log.

Workouts are fine, thanks for asking. I may update tonite.

[tshay2003]

First off.. awesome thread. I love threads like these.. lots of learning material. Now a couple questions..

Trying to learn a thing or two here: So NO2 expands arteries allowing more blood to your muscles. Now is it more blood in general in your muscles that benefits, or is it the excess nitrous.. or maybe even oxygen to your muscles? I understand the fact about blood expanding the muscle filaments so that they (i'm assuming here) stay anabolic and rebuild in an expanded state. Now, here is the big question i was getting to, and i don't want to sway topic here, but is that kind of the same as creatine causing water retention in muscles? A swelling effect so to speak...

AAHH, the other question i almost forgot. Why do they recommend keeping Glutamine supplementation under 10 grams per day. Now i've always thought 10 grams was quite a bit unless you are in some serious bodybuilding training, but maybe i'm wrong. Does Glutamine interfere with Arginine somehow?

[King Kabuki]

The difference between creatine and arginine is that with Creatine you're only getting a water-pump with minimal vasodilation. With the Nitrous you're getting more actual bloodflow into your muscles, which also means that everything in your bloodstream is duly fed into muscle tissue. Creatine works on the premise mostly of hydration, which promotes oxygenation, but you're missing the Nitrogen.

About glutamine, I'm not positive. But it's not uncommon for isolated aminos to compete for absorption in the body. It might have something to do with that. Also some aminos when taken in excess will negate the properties of other aminos. This is why you take Nitrous Boosters, and also BCAA's always on an empty stomach.

[Chad Hamilton]

Should you take it on all training days, or just days using high volume work. Is it beneficial to take it when say, powerlifting or 3 rep snatches or just bodybuilding type workouts?

Should you take it even when not training...off day?

[King Kabuki]

They recommend you half-dose on non-training days. But with a supplement this expensive I tend not to use it on non-training days. The effects are supposed to be longer-sustaining than creatine, so I don't see a need to take it on off-days. In terms of the workouts, I think it benefits any kind of workout.

[Madmick]

I agree with Hany's contention of what vasodilation would achieve, but this doesn't address Terumo's objection, since because (according to Terumo) the conversion agent isn't amplified, the increase of arginine in the bloodstream will not result in vasodilation.

If NO products do indeed cause vasodilation, I'm on board. Hell, I used them, and I thought they worked, but I don't trust my own mind. My mind deceives me all the time. Told me that one bitch loved me, I'm still pissed about that, aren't I mind? Yeah, I'm talking to you fuckwad, Mr. You and Mr. Dick need to have a discussion about priorities. We miss that loveless pussy, don't we? Oh, we do, my precious, we do.

Was this covered in the other thread? I don't see it. Okay, I'll check again.

Also, I don't want to go to prison or fight Chad.

[King Kabuki]

I agree with Hany's contention of what vasodilation would achieve, but this doesn't address Terumo's objection, since because (according to Terumo) the conversion agent isn't amplified, the increase of arginine in the bloodstream will not result in vasodilation.

In all seriousness Mick, I don't think the FDA as hard-ass as it is on the supplement Industry would allow MRI to market NO2 particularly with "Hemodilator" written right on the bottle if they didn't give credible evidence that it did indeed serve the purpose it's intended to. I mean this is the same organization that pulls supplements off the shelf for even HINTING that they can do anything to combat any specific illness or cause any benefitial improvements to people.

However, Hany went on to say that No-Xplode itself, along with Superpump are two reputable Nitrous boosters and that he recommends them to all of his clients. I just didn't want to quote that part because it sounds a lot like a sales-pitch. Out of all the nitrous boosters out there right now I'm only sold on 2 of them. NO2 is one, No-Xplode is the other, because I've used them both properly and they both worked for me, that and good feedback.

Though I will say one thing again regarding cost. MRI charges WAY too much for time-released versions of regular supplements. Seems to me there's got to be a less-costly way, but then again my mind deceives me too at times.

[Madmick]

Check you bottle Kabuki. I remember NO-Xplode containing the disclaimer that "These claims are not evaluated by the FDA..."

I know they changed the laws a bit recently on herbs, but I think that was only for safety disclaimers (to avoid future fiascos like the ephedra ban that resulted because of stupid, stupid fucking people). I still see all sorts of claims on the herbs that have been proven not to work.

Terumo's post was concrete on a biochemical level. I'm putting a lot of faith in someone who I don't actually know (it's not like I met him at the NYU Chemistry Department), but until I see something that addresses his very simple and very specific argument, I will continue to advise against NO.

We need to get him back. Dammit.

[Rjkd12]

Ok, with school starting and being busy, I have come down to skimming long threads like this. So, I apologize if this isn't relevant or has already been discussed.

I don't have a large contribution, but I disagree with one of the statements above.

2) Taking caffeine or ephedra products with the Nitrous Products. These stimulants have vaso-constrictive effects, and will defeat the purpose for trying to force more blood into the muscle to get the better pump.

When working at GNC I was asked by many people why caffeine was recommended for exercise when it is a vasoconstrictor. Well, I finally found an answer when i got sick of saying "Uh.. dunno."

Stimulants such as adrenaline (epi/norepi) are produced when you exercise and they effect different parts of the body differently. They vasoconstrict certain veins/arteries (such as digestive, in the brain [be brain gets vasoconstricted because the brain needs a constant blood flow and with increased heart rate you need to vasoconstrict to get the same amount of net blood flow]), and other vasodialate (such as the muscles in use).

So, what does all this crap mean? Caffeine does vasoconstrict certain artieries/veins, as in the brain and digestive tract (why you don't get hungry), but it VASODIALATES ateries to muscles similarly as epi/norepi.

So, caffeine should increase blood flow to muscles. I know saying one thing this guy has said is wrong doesn't take apart his whole argument; but IMO this isn't a complicated topic for someone who works with professional BB's. I get concered about the whole argument when someone uses info like this for a product. This and Tumero's statements make me concered about the efficacy of these products.