Ran a 5:45 mile yesterday

[trojansc82]

I did it on a treadmill, but I was pretty happy with it. I used a treadmill that goes over 10, otherwise I would have run about 15 seconds slower at 6:00. I don't really have a plan for training, just been running about 3 miles about 4 or 5 times a week at 8 miles per hour.

Anybody have a good training regimen for getting a mile run down faster?

[TMMAray]

I'm being completely friendly when I say that this is probably not a good place to ask that question. You would probably be much better served at a running forum.

That having been said, the few bits of advice I would give:

Don't overtrain. It's a huge problem with runners. Doing 5 or so hard workouts per week is not productive.
Do speedwork, but not sprint work. If you're doing 400m repeats, you should be running just a bit faster than your mile pace. When I could run a < 5:00 mile, I would hang right around 70 sec on my 400s. If you do this, you will make more progress than if you were running 60s (obviously your goal time is different depending on your speed. The point is: you're training for the mile, not the 400)
Do VO2 max workouts. A simple one: Run for 3 minutes at your max VO2 pace (which for you I would guess is about 6 min miles, so try to run right at a half-mile in that 3 minutes). Rest for an equal amount of time, and repeat.
Finally (I have to get ready for work). Focus on your foot turnover rate when you run. Even when running slowly, you should try to keep your stepping rate high. Essentially, up to a certain point, your speed should change as a result of lengthening and shortening your stride, not speeding up or slowing down your stepping rate. 180 steps per minute is generally a good rate to shoot for. (if you need to get a feel for this, just count each time your left foot hits the ground for a minute, and find the rhythm that gets you to 90 counts per minute. Once you've got that rhythm in your head, try to keep your step rate the same regardless of speed, and use stride length to determine how fast you run).

Also, stretch after you run. I prefer to do a combination of dynamic and resistance stretching, but you may prefer something else. Oh...and a good PWO shake would be a good idea as well. Like any other type of training, workout recovery is one of the biggest parts of making progress in running.

[Ian Coe]

Originally Posted by TMMAray

I'm being completely friendly when I say that this is probably not a good place to ask that question. You would probably be much better served at a running forum.

That having been said, the few bits of advice I would give:

Don't overtrain. It's a huge problem with runners. Doing 5 or so hard workouts per week is not productive.
Do speedwork, but not sprint work. If you're doing 400m repeats, you should be running just a bit faster than your mile pace. When I could run a < 5:00 mile, I would hang right around 70 sec on my 400s. If you do this, you will make more progress than if you were running 60s (obviously your goal time is different depending on your speed. The point is: you're training for the mile, not the 400)
Do VO2 max workouts. A simple one: Run for 3 minutes at your max VO2 pace (which for you I would guess is about 6 min miles, so try to run right at a half-mile in that 3 minutes). Rest for an equal amount of time, and repeat.
Finally (I have to get ready for work). Focus on your foot turnover rate when you run. Even when running slowly, you should try to keep your stepping rate high. Essentially, up to a certain point, your speed should change as a result of lengthening and shortening your stride, not speeding up or slowing down your stepping rate. 180 steps per minute is generally a good rate to shoot for. (if you need to get a feel for this, just count each time your left foot hits the ground for a minute, and find the rhythm that gets you to 90 counts per minute. Once you've got that rhythm in your head, try to keep your step rate the same regardless of speed, and use stride length to determine how fast you run).

Also, stretch after you run. I prefer to do a combination of dynamic and resistance stretching, but you may prefer something else. Oh...and a good PWO shake would be a good idea as well. Like any other type of training, workout recovery is one of the biggest parts of making progress in running.

That's some interesting stuff

I'm interested if you think you should not run 400m sprints at all, or just use 400 repeat distances to basically train running at a faster pace.

I've advocated in running using 400 and 800 m repeats, but at the pace you require and then lowerig the rest.
Say you want to run 5 miles in 30 minutes. Thats a 6 minute mile pace, so 1 min 30s a lap. So you run at that pace, rest for say 1 minute, and run it again and again for 20 intervals. Then as you get better, you reduced each resting interval until its nonexistant and you're running the whole 5 miles in 30 minutes.

[erznana]

That's pretty fucking fast. That's damn near sprinting speed. Kudos.

[EyeNeyE**]

wow. decent time. I don't think I've gotten below 6 mins yet. then again, I haven't timed myself in 4 years

[TMMAray]

Originally Posted by Ian Coe

That's some interesting stuff

I'm interested if you think you should not run 400m sprints at all, or just use 400 repeat distances to basically train running at a faster pace.

Sprints definitely have their uses. Namely, if you want to develop a more powerful kick, you obviously need the pure speed to support that. I've seen plenty of people get outkicked at the end of the race by someone who was much more tired than they were, but had sprinting speed, whereas the other person ran as fast as they could, and finished the race with energy to spare because they simply lacked the capacity to run any faster. However, if you're not using them to address a specific issue, sprints will get you less overall results than other workouts for that day.

I've advocated in running using 400 and 800 m repeats, but at the pace you require and then lowerig the rest. Say you want to run 5 miles in 30 minutes. Thats a 6 minute mile pace, so 1 min 30s a lap. So you run at that pace, rest for say 1 minute, and run it again and again for 20 intervals. Then as you get better, you reduced each resting interval until its nonexistant and you're running the whole 5 miles in 30 minutes.

In theory, you would think that would work, but it's just not nearly as effective as other ways (in fact, very, very few people will ever make the transition all the way to no rest using that system). You'll see much better results running 400m repeats (starting at 6 and going up to 10, sometimes 12 is a common system people use) at about 5 seconds faster than your mile pace. So for you at present, I would suggest running 400m in 80-82 seconds, resting for about that same amount of time, and repeating. Starting at 6 reps and increasing by 1 each week if possible. A simple schedule might be:

Monday: 400m repeats
Tuesday: Easy day. "Easy" depends on you. For me an easy day would be something like 3 miles at a 7ish pace. You may want to do more or less, faster or slower. Basically, run at a pace that you feel you could more or less maintain indefinitely, for a distance that is enough for you to feel energized and loosened up, but not fatigued.
Wednesday: 800m repeats. The one I've always liked is the simple "run at your VO2 max pace for 3 minutes, rest for 3 minutes, repeat." Your VO2 max pace is basically the fastest pace you could maintain for 11 minutes. For you, I would put that right about 6 min miles, so a half-mile each repeat. It's important here to try to stay as close to this pace as possible, and also to maintain a steady pace throughout (in other words, ideally run exactly 800m in 3 minutes, and run each quarter in 90 seconds). I would suggest starting with 4 repeats, and moving up as you're able to. I would recommend doing as many repeats as you're able to while still keeping the proper pace, up to 8 repeats.
Thursday: Easy day
Friday: 1.5-2 mile fast. Not necessarily all-out runs, but maybe 10-15 seconds per mile off racing pace. If you want to re-test your mile time, this would be the day to do it. Additionally, I'd suggest you retest your mile each 4-6 weeks and adjust your target times accordingly.
Saturday: Easy day
Sunday: Easy day or don't run at all, whichever you feel like.

THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS:

1. Eat well
2. Do not overtrain. Train hard, but know the difference between a good workout and an excessive one.
3. Train properly. Do the exercises as they're supposed to be done. For example, we had guys on my high school track team who, when doing 400s in practice, would run the first one in 58-60 seconds, the next one in 90, the next one in 65 seconds, the 4th in 100 seconds...so guess what happened in races? They ran the first lap in 60 seconds, and then ran a 95, then a 100, then an 85. The whole purpose of these workouts is to train your body to recognize the pace that it can run, and to be able to produce that pace. Doing this right will keep you from being the jackass who explodes out the gate and then dies 500 meters into the run.
4. Find what's best for you. Try the things that other people suggest, and take what works for you. Every runner has a different training style. Some are barely different, and some vastly. If there were a single best workout, all the best people would be doing it. So...remember that ultimately, what matters is what works best for you.


Also, I am aware that the person I quoted was not the TS, but it was more convenient to respond by addressing the TS, and using him as a base for the program I described.

As always, everything I say is simply my opinion which was formed based upon all the knowledge I have on the subject. Much of it is subjective and directly conflicts with other philosophies that have also yielded good results. I simply feel that in my experience, the recommendations that I make are the ones most likely to produce the best results.

[NiGhtt]

Nice job on the time.

[Ian Coe]

TMMAray

I'm always looking for insight into different areas.

Thanks for the info.


Because the distance you run as described are quite short, would you just extend these to longer runs (ie more reps), or would you go about it in a different way?

[TMMAray]

Originally Posted by Ian Coe

TMMAray

I'm always looking for insight into different areas.

Thanks for the info.


Because the distance you run as described are quite short, would you just extend these to longer runs (ie more reps), or would you go about it in a different way?

The workout I gave was intended to be specific to improving mile time. You would probably still see good results by using the same program for the 2-mile, particularly if you were able to work in a couple more repeats on your 400s and 800s (once again, without going overboard. literally do a couple more). For distances shorter than the mile and longer than 2 miles, you should probably do a completely different program.

Anyhow...the basis of the program is that the 400s teach your body to steadily run faster than your race pace for longer than the race is. The 800s are a tried and true way to raise your VO2 max, and the friday workout is to keep your body used to the feeling of running hard without taking breaks.

Note once again, this is intended as a miler/possibly 2 miler workout, and is also built on the assumption that the person is already in decent shape...results may vary.

[Ian Coe]

I see

Well it's something to remember for later for myself.

Currently I'm trying to drop my 5 miler time, which is why I asked.