Throwing defensive opponents

[SmashiusClay]

Originally Posted by Bubble Boy

Ok, you've done this before... ??? Seems like maybe so...

But I'll play along.

2.4) Your opponent steps backward then kouchi gari is what I've had the most luck with but a lot of people seem to often suggest Osoto gari. Plus there's always the ever faithful ouchi gari again.

The soto makikomi does expose the back in all the other grappling arts (bjj, wrestling, sub grappling), but by judo comp rules it's not that big of a deal. I think if you hold on to that arm for a kimura or similar arm bar technique (see Karo Parisyan) then it can work out ok. Again, there's risks to all techniques, and possibley giving up the back to a good makikomi throw is certainly a looming prospect. Control the arm and I think it's a reasonably decent throw.

I find an opponent who's leaning forward and trying to back up is generally easy to off balance forwards and sideways. As he starts moving just stop and pull back while twisting and you should be able to drive them off balance finishing with a tai otoshi or similar.

I've always had trouble with trying to get close enough to pull off a sweep as their legs are going away from me, but maybe i'm mistiming it.

I've also found that one of my favourite combos works nicely from here, set up as if you were going for a tai otoshi but don't turn quite so deeply and place the attacking leg only between theirs (instead of all the way in front). If you get this right they should be forced to pull their inside leg up and out of the way and end up balanced on one leg, moving into the direction you were turining them (this also helps to make them straighten up). Then just re adjust your leg position for a real tai otoshi, as they're on one leg and miving the right way they'll flip with ease.

[judogido]

Aaaah I LOVE people who bend over like this (uuuh - not in a "I dropped my soap in the shower" way).

I'm tall, so I like to take an over to top grip, with my right hand reaching over & gripping the jacket on their back - just on their left shoulder-blade.

From this position, with them bent-over I like to do: osoto-gari, uchi-mata ken-ken and sumi-gaeshi. The sumi-gaeshi I especially do if they try to shoot from this position.

The other thing I do from here is with a standard jacket grip. I like to do a drop seoi-nage, but only if they are not stiff-arming. If they are stiff-arming I have to break one of their grips off, their LEFT if I want to turn-in right, their RIGHT if I want to turn-in left (which I do from a right-grip - I dont change grips). I can then turn without them blocking me. The drop works well because they are already leaning forwards too much.

[Q mystic]

In bjj what are the rules to grabbing the opponents sleeve at the wrist. Not many if I recall and you can work him easy with that. A couple good yanks and he will pull his arms in. He is quite off balance there.

[pyr0]

Use the armdrag to get behind them and take them down that way.

[Q mystic]

Originally Posted by Luther

Thanks guys, very helpful. I'll try the "over the shoulder" grip in the practice session this evening. IIRC there was a thread about it around here, but I seem unable to find right now.

Is it possible to do Uchimata with that kumikata? (I'm a big fan of Uchimata-Ouchigari combo)

Damn....whats that one where you thorw with both sleeves? A judo throw. Nice too.

If he has his arms out like that, 'airplane' him.

[Ybot]

Originally Posted by Q mystic

In bjj what are the rules to grabbing the opponents sleeve at the wrist. Not many if I recall and you can work him easy with that. A couple good yanks and he will pull his arms in. He is quite off balance there.

The only gripping rules I know of for BJJ is you can't grip with more than one finger inside the sleeve...

By the way, I love this thread, I'm a tall guy too and this is giving me all kinds of ideas. Fun stuff, I need to train Judo.

[azjudoboxer]

Originally Posted by Luther

A lot of guys around me start the fight (BJJ) pulling the guard or bending heavily at the waist, with arms extended or not: like that, but sometimes even more bent. I did a little of Judo, but because of my poor skills, that stance seems almost "throw-proof".

Since I'm committed to improve my stand-up game (tachi-waza), I need some basic strategy to attack this defensive position, like set-up and follow-up techniques, and what throws are more advantageous for my body type. I'm a BJJ blue belt, 5'11'', 170 lbs, with long legs. Because of my "slender" build I'm usually taller of my opponents in my weight class, and sometimes weaker too.

So, what game plan would you suggest?


P.S. I plan to take again Judo classes, but for now I can just train at my accademy.

Don't attack them, let them come to you, Let them present an oppurtunity for a throw. When I 1st started doign Judo i would rush in and try for a throw, and get shut down, or thrown everytime. After getting my ass handed to me many times i realized the guys simpyl waited for me to come to them, and present a throw for them

[350 lbs fist]

I've seen some guys just grabbing the gi at the collar or on the back of a crouching opponent and just proceed to yank them down to the floor.
There probably is a technical name for this in judo?
Anyone got the name and/or a graphic of this technique?
( It would be good for me I think due to my innate superior gravity one might say. )

[HammerF1st]

If someone tries to bend forward to resist throws, front headlock them and work form there.

[TJS]

excellent thread here..lots of good info.