Law Alabama House committee OKs bill requiring safe storage of firearms

[terrapin]

Nice...Set Up Brother. I lived in "urban" area for a while and I remember dudes I ran with would walk past their moms on several occasions carrying guns anything from .22's to AK 47's . These moms and grandmas knew that had illegal guns in the house...my question is if these kids commit crimes and murder people with those guns do you think the parents should be held accountable as well?

I think if it's the parents guns that are used and the parents didn't have them in safes then the parents should be held liable.

Not sure about the scenario you posted. I hadn't really thought about that angle before. If the parents didn't help them get the guns then they can't really know for a fact that the guns are illegal so I don't know why the parents would be held liable for that.

 

[terrapin]

lol apparently not those on the far left

I get wanting some guns to be lost in a boating accident but what I don't get is how you shoot someone in your home who's trying to rape your wife with a gun you lost in a boating accident.

 

[Rob Battisti]

I get wanting some guns to be lost in a boating accident but what I don't get is how you shoot someone in your home who's trying to rape your wife with a gun you lost in a boating accident.

The guns washed ashore during a day out fishing, duh!

 

[Andy Capp]

Nice...Set Up Brother. I lived in "urban" area for a while and I remember dudes I ran with would walk past their moms on several occasions carrying guns anything from .22's to AK 47's . These moms and grandmas knew that had illegal guns in the house...my question is if these kids commit crimes and murder people with those guns do you think the parents should be held accountable as well?

LMAO @ the quotes around urban--you shitbag.

 

[Andy Capp]

@Andy Capp don’t be scared, homie.

About what, ditch pig? You couldn't respond to my point so you introduced a strawman. Get bent and stop wasting my time.

 

[Andy Capp]

lol... I thought everyone knew the old, "my guns got lost in a boating accident" line.

So, you're saying it's awesome that you've taken criminal measures to obscure the provenance of your weapons or to scam your insurance company? Good job, we all thought you were a stand up guy and now we know for sure what you're really like.

 

[Rob Battisti]

As it pertains to "their firearm was used", isn't dealing with it after the fact like closing the barn door after the horses have bolted? I.e. too little too late to help the victim?

About what, ditch pig? You couldn't respond to my point so you introduced a strawman. Get bent and stop wasting my time.

Why are you being rude?

I answered your question.

Yes, it is punishment after an incident. If it is not that, how else do you enforce this?

There is only one way to do it pre-incident.

The only way is you have to catalog who has what guns and obtain proof of how those guns are being stored.

Otherwise, it’s a post incident law.

Unless you have another way.

Be civil.

 

[Andy Capp]

Why are you being rude?

I answered your question.

Yes, it is punishment after an incident. If it is not that, how else do you enforce this?

There is only one way to do it pre-incident.

The only way is you have to catalog who has what guns and obtain proof of how those guns are being stored.

Otherwise, it’s a post incident law.

Unless you have another way.

Be civil.

What's the thread title say? I repeat
Not worth a fuck.

 

[Whippy McGee]

So, you're saying it's awesome that you've taken criminal measures to obscure the provenance of your weapons or to scam your insurance company? Good job, we all thought you were a stand up guy and now we know for sure.

It's like you got trampled by a cow... slowly.

 

[Andy Capp]

It's like you got trampled by a cow... slowly.

So, how many of Trump's lawyers have been disbarred? Have you got a count yet? More than 5, right? I noticed you didn't respond to my question about that in the other thread so I thought a reminder might be helpful.

 

[Poon Goon]

I bolted my safe to the floor in a spot that's hard to get to. Idea was to make it difficult for any bandits to see, open, or take. The problem is that it's a pain in the ass for me to get into it too.

 

[Andy Capp]

I bolted my safe to the floor in a spot that's hard to get to. Idea was to make it difficult for any bandits to see, open, or take. The problem is that it's a pain in the ass for me to get into it too.

You, of all people, Mr. Poon, should know the five p's, proper planning prevents piss poor performance.

And anyway, if it's a pain in the ass to get into you're clearly doing it wrong.

 

[Poon Goon]

You, of all people, Mr. Poon, should know the five p's, proper planning prevents piss poor performance.

And anyway, if it's a pain in the ass to get into you're clearly doing it wrong.

I don't have children in my house so I have multiple guns that are easily accessible for defense purposes. Extras are in the safe, but it's still a pain to go grab them when it's time to hit the range. Also, there are 6 p's in your saying.

 

[Jonathan Utah]

This isn’t a requirement everywhere? Thought it would be common sense.

 

[Andy Capp]

I don't have children in my house so I have multiple guns that are easily accessible for defense purposes. Extras are in the safe, but it's still a pain to go grab them when it's time to hit the range. Also, there are 6 p's in your saying.

Just joshing, of course, and I'm a bit pooped myself--but good observation.

 

[Rob Battisti]

What's the thread title say? I repeat
Not worth a fuck.

I guess you just don’t know. Why are you so angry? What did I say to you here to make you act so childish?

 

[BFoe]

What you say is reasonable. But I am pretty sure that no one was going to farmer Ted and telling him he was storing his powder wrong and threatening to prosecute him over it. So it was more like suggestions back then.

If the left had their way, and could make all guns disappear with a snap of fingers, they would do that. The right knows this, so they fight every gun control law they can.

My biggest issue is that gun control crowd will prosecute a normal, everyday law abiding citizen for any infraction when it comes to guns but they won’t even consider enforcing harsher penalties on criminals. In fact, george gascon got rid of gun enhancements and gang enhancements in violent crimes. Why? Because it affects minorities too much. But he would have no issue prosecuting your neighbor bill if he didn’t store his guns correctly.

On your first point, the state government certainly could and did show up to inspect a person’s weapons, as many states requires citizens to have certain types of weapons and have them in working order, for the purpose of the state militia.
—But aside from that, the MA gunpowder storage law I mentioned earlier ITT had all imported gunpowder stored in “powder houses” in the city. Providence, RI in 1798 or so enacted a law prohibiting possession of more than 28 lbs of gunpowder, with the consequence of violating the law not only being a fine but forfeiture of the gunpowder.
I think calling these laws a “suggestion” is an exaggeration.

More importantly though, is that safe storage laws aren’t going to be enforced by the police or government going door to door to see if people are storing their weapons correctly or not. Surely you must be aware of that.
You pass a law, you include consequences that one hopes will be sufficient to motivate a person to follow the law, and if a crime occurs with a firearm and it’s determined through investigation that it wasn’t stored properly, there’s criminal liability consequences. Many laws work this way.

I won’t waste time on the assertion that we liberals would make all guns disappear if we could. With all due respect that’s just silly fear-mongering. There are millions of liberal/Dem gun owners.

 

[BFoe]

Thankfully Heller was ruled like it was . . . Since that court ruled the 2A guarantees the right to "keep and bear arms" you're cool with everyone carrying openly then?

Heller is a mess, McDonald is far worse, and Bruen is basically incomprehensible and unworkable. I’m happy to elaborate on any of those statements if needed.

As to your open carry question: if you mean that we as a society need to respect SCOTUS’s decisions, then sure.
But not even Heller or McDonald was cool with *everyone* open carrying, with Scalia saying the 2A was “not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.”
He also says that “The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.”

So I wouldn’t say that I am personally “cool” with it. The SCOTUS has been dead ass wrong about every 2A case since 2008, and the more Americans realize that, the more we can work towards getting out of this mess.

As spread out as things got and with so few schools, etc. I'm not sure I see how the literacy rate was the same in the West as it was in one of the original colonies.

I didn’t say it was the same, just that it didn’t decline significantly. Parents still taught their kids to read, even if all they had was a Bible.

You have to remember that prior to McDonald in 2010, the 2A only restrained the federal government, not the states. The reason no one objected to all these 2A state laws I’ve mentioned isn’t because they were illiterate, it’s because they didn’t think those laws were unconstitutional. Because they weren’t.

I disagree that gunpowder is the same as a firearm, but we disagree a lot of things.

I didn’t say gunpowder = firearm.
I said the gunpowder storage laws and this AL gun storage law are both examples of safe storage laws which have a long history of being constitutional. There are also colonial laws against having a loaded weapon in any building or dwelling that I could point to, if we wanted to go that route. But yes, we do disagree on much

Meh . . . things are progressing as they should. We don't need the government to dictate a lot of things to us today. Especially when we have judges like that one in NY that said "Do not bring the Second Amendment into this courtroom. It doesn’t exist here. So you can’t argue Second Amendment. This is New York."

Making it nearly impossible for states to regulate firearms isn’t progress. We have far more dangerous firearms commercially available than ever before, so I don’t agree with the idea that we needed safety laws in the past but not now. Gun violence in our communities is far more of a concern now than it ever has been.

I don’t know the exact context of that NY judge’s remark, but it’s interesting: had he made that comment anytime between 1792-2010, he’d be 100% correct. In fact, what he said is just a more blunt version of what SCOTUS said in the very first 2A case we ever had, US v Cruickshank.
But I agree that he shouldn’t say that, or decide the case based on that idea, in light of the McDonald decision.

 

[spamking]

Heller is a mess, McDonald is far worse, and Bruen is basically incomprehensible and unworkable. I’m happy to elaborate on any of those statements if needed.

As to your open carry question: if you mean that we as a society need to respect SCOTUS’s decisions, then sure.
But not even Heller or McDonald was cool with *everyone* open carrying, with Scalia saying the 2A was “not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.”
He also says that “The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.”

So I wouldn’t say that I am personally “cool” with it. The SCOTUS has been dead ass wrong about every 2A case since 2008, and the more Americans realize that, the more we can work towards getting out of this mess.


I didn’t say it was the same, just that it didn’t decline significantly. Parents still taught their kids to read, even if all they had was a Bible.

You have to remember that prior to McDonald in 2010, the 2A only restrained the federal government, not the states. The reason no one objected to all these 2A state laws I’ve mentioned isn’t because they were illiterate, it’s because they didn’t think those laws were unconstitutional. Because they weren’t.


I didn’t say gunpowder = firearm.
I said the gunpowder storage laws and this AL gun storage law are both examples of safe storage laws which have a long history of being constitutional. There are also colonial laws against having a loaded weapon in any building or dwelling that I could point to, if we wanted to go that route. But yes, we do disagree on much



Making it nearly impossible for states to regulate firearms isn’t progress. We have far more dangerous firearms commercially available than ever before, so I don’t agree with the idea that we needed safety laws in the past but not now. Gun violence in our communities is far more of a concern now than it ever has been.

I don’t know the exact context of that NY judge’s remark, but it’s interesting: had he made that comment anytime between 1792-2010, he’d be 100% correct. In fact, what he said is just a more blunt version of what SCOTUS said in the very first 2A case we ever had, US v Cruickshank.
But I agree that he shouldn’t say that, or decide the case based on that idea, in light of the McDonald decision.